Xiang Liu and You (Yes, You)

 Kokuto:

Oh no!  Not the crying!!

I thought just his face made you want to jump into your phone and give him a hug. ;p

Poor baby ??

 Elise:

laughing to hide the pain ? https://www.youtube.com/shorts/2D41RLa4fYo

episode 19, I hate this episode the most. his hurt face kills me https://www.youtube.com/shorts/lMF7PCgou5k

The first one made me dislike XY so much. We're supposed to cheer for her, but as a fellow woman, I can't seem to.  

 nathsketch:

the message the writer seems to be sending that someone broken and abused and enslaved his entire existence doesn't deserve to be loved.

 nathsketch:

No one really talks about the overall moral of the story. And it seems to me that it just perpetuates this idea that the "different" ones deserve to be abused, to be vilified, and finally, to be denied a happy ending. We see this in countless novels, from Hans Christian Andersen to Victor Hugo. Same with all the traditional monster stories.

Ah, I can see why you would hate the ending if you view it through this lens. 

 nathsketch:

Anyway, the author claims that he's her favorite character and I don't doubt that, but she still refuses to break this cycle of continued abuse he's been subjected to his entire life. She gives him this semblance of self-determination by making clear to us that no matter how tragic people may perceive his ending to be, it's something that he chose for himself, as a sort of consolation for the readers. Well, of course, he could never choose anything other than that, because he himself doesn't think he deserves anything more than just dying gloriously on the battlefield.

One thing I would point out that might provide some consolation: XL leaves the North Pole to take care of FFB's mother for four years. In that time, he experiences a mother's unconditional love. And afterwards he continues to be FFB without putting up any pretences. He was just himself. At that point he was unburdened. He was living the life that XY later wishes she could have given him if she had been the person who saved him after he escaped from the death match arena. I don't know for sure how long he lived like that, but he left the North Pole about 430 years ago and CX and XY were separated for three hundred years after Sheng Nong was defeated... so I'd guess that XL lived as FFB (either exclusively as FFB or going back and forth between being FFB and being a free demon with no other obligations) for almost 130 years before he reunited with Gong Gong.

When Sheng Nong is conquered and Gong Gong is cornered and abandoned, XL chooses to go to him to repay his debt. He chooses to fight with the remnant army, and his relationship with Gong Gong ends up becoming so strong that Gong Gong adopts him as a son. To me, that isn't the story of a monster who has never experienced any kind of love, who believes he doesn't deserve anything more than death. It's the story of an incredibly loyal person. The opposite of a fair weather friend. Someone who is choosy about who they spend their time with, but once they choose the connection is unparalleled. 

In Once Promised, Gong Gong is known as someone whose promise is worth a thousand taels of gold. He always keeps his word, no matter what. XL is a similarly extreme. For the people he loves, he will give his everything. One could look at that and see only something sad... but to me, although that self-sacrifice is indeed sad, I can also see it as something that would bring such a sense of meaning and purpose. To have such deep relationships and to have such a big impact... it makes me think that, in his own way, he lived well.  

With XL and XY... I don't see the barrier between them as a sense of unworthiness on XL's part. At least not in the novel. It feels more like Romeo and Juliet than the Phantom of the Opera or the original Little Mermaid. But with XY's abandonment issues added as an extra layer of tragedy on top of their opposite-sides-of-a-war fate. 

That's not to say that XL doesn't carry any trauma. He was born alone. He was captured, enslaved, and made to fight to the death over and over to survive. After Gong Gong saved him, he didn't trust him and fled all the way to the North Pole. Hundreds of years later, he is powerful but clearly used to most people (who know him as XL) treating him, a nine-headed demon and a fierce warrior, as something strange and scary. He didn't trust people easily back when he met Gong Gong, and he still doesn't trust people easily by the time he meets XY. He tests her constantly. But he also falls for her so quickly. He bonds with her. Takes her out just to watch the full moon rise. He knew how to appreciate the world's beauty, and he was willing to take a leap of faith when he offered to take on XY's poisonous bug... 

I'm getting further away from my point now, but what I'm trying to say is that I see a lot of beauty and find a lot of satisfaction in XL's story. I see something very different from what that reddit user sees. 

I agreed with all Nath said

I love @AH explanation soooo much! I also want see and believe in things like this 

But it's not something I saw in drama

XL life as FFB we didn't see it, we know that he was assassin that whole time, his friends asholes, so I not sure that his life was free and happy, it's something we can only guess and imagine

Second about being unworthy, it's exactly what drama show us... when XY said that XL not type of man that should be in girl dream, or when XL said CX that he will never ruin XY reputation with such horrible demon as him, everything shows is that he think he doesn't deserve her and love and freedom.. as TJC said XL person who pay for small kindness with 10000 more , which also shows he think he doesn't deserve kindness and need repay for it.

For example XY, after XL feed her blood and take care of her for 37 years!! Think it's enough that CX gave XL some mountain for graves and she doesn't owe him anything, even gratitude.. 

Also about Romeo and Juliet, it's more in novel , in drama I even not sure she actually likes him, because feelings from her side very uncertain and we see only some hints and should imagine ourselves that she actually likes him

Maybe second part will change my opinion, but for now it's like thia

 Elise:

they're excited for season 2 the most because it's that fox's time to shine! He got his happy ending because it was XL that made it possible ?

Not reminds me ??? I will skips their all scenes, I just can't see them happy, when XL will horrible dying at that time

 nathsketch:

The first one made me dislike XY so much. We're supposed to cheer for her, but as a fellow woman, I can't seem to.  

She hurt our 9 headed baby!!!  Of course, we aren't going to cheer for her.  I had to watch this several times and understand what was actually the problem between these two, before I felt much empathy for XY.  It was also really hit home for me that this was not going to be the standard love story, where the characters want to overcome obstacles for love.

 Elise:

I found XY more relatable and likeable when she was still Wen Xiao Liu. It's like ever since she became a princess, she became annoying... I didn't like some of the choices she made. 

Part of that was she had different responsibilities.  Part of it was she was experimenting with being a woman -- something she really didn't have much experience with.

Halp!!  My big dog is climbing onto my laptop!

Now he's grabbing my hand with his mouth.

I don't think he wants me online.