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Xiang Liu and Xiao Yao’s Story and Romance

windiaaa041293

@liddi do you have the script,when WXL and XL's hair gets entangled together.

第11集，小夭和相柳在葫芦湖旁边，相柳这时已经确定自己喜欢小六了。看他身后，一直有流萤的光，就是告诉大家他现在的内心。剧本里，这段戏添了一个原著中没有的场景，后来被删了。小六的发丝与相柳的纠缠到了一起，这就是暗示他俩的关系“结发夫妻”。

In Episode 11, Xiaoyao and Xiangliu are at Hulu Lake. Xiangliu is already sure that he likes Xiaoliu. Looking behind him, there was always the light of fireflies, telling everyone what he felt in his heart at this moment. In the script, this scene was supplemented with scenes that were not in the original work, but were later deleted. Xiao Liu's hair is entangled with Xiang Liu's hair, which implies that their relationship is "husband and wife".

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liddi
 windiaaa041293:
@liddi do you have the script,when WXL and XL's hair gets entangled together.

Unfortunately no. I am still trying to find the leaked script for the original S1 as well - can you please share if you do see it? 

The leaked script for S2 actually starts from the end of Ep30, indicating S1 was originally intended to end with Xiao Yao's assassination and being brought to the ocean for healing. I am not as certain right now that the fireflies behind Xiang Liu in that scene was meant to indicate his feelings, but it would certainly be interesting to see how the original script actually described that scene. Certainly, in the leaked script, the 37 years under the ocean specifically mentioned the glow of the lovers bug in their hearts in different times and I charted the glow of the lovers bugs based on the script and drama here.  I also compared the leaked script vs the drama of the 37 years healing under the ocean here.

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blabla100

@liddi

"相伴一生 literally means "accompany for a lifetime". The keyword here is 一生 "a lifetime", or specifically her lifetime.  The way I see it, his last question triggered her immensely because when she sent the crystal globe to him, accepting that he would still persist in his stance, she was resigned to the fact that if he agreed to take her hand, the life they shared would not last her lifetime. He had determined to fight, and she knew that one day he would die, and she would be alone once more. She was willing to settle for a companionship that was temporary, as long as he was willing to let her be a part of his life. As such, she refused to think of whom she wanted to spend the entirety of her own life with, because she wanted to spend her lifetime with him, but she knew it would never be possible. "

Thank you for this. I always thought that the crystal ball was also a submission from her part to XL's life choices, but I couldn't figured out why than the last question was so painful for her to answer, nothing made much sense. Now reading your interpretation, it seems so obvious. 

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windiaaa041293

"Lost You Forever 3": Only by reflecting on the past can we live better in the present.

Author Network Reporter: "Lost You Forever 3: Longing for No End" has been published, and the Lost You Forever series has also reached its final ending. After months of anticipation, readers can't wait to see this "perfect ending" do you think now? Will readers be satisfied with the ending? Do you think the ending of this story is satisfying?

Tong Hua: I don't know! Based on past experience, it is always difficult to unify opinions. Some are satisfied and some are dissatisfied. I don't know how to rate this ending. To me, the story always felt like a "temporary ending", because the story could only end at a certain point, and in my heart, all fresh life was still going on in that world, but I wouldn't write about it again.

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windiaaa041293
 liddi:

Unfortunately no. I am still trying to find the leaked script for the original S1 as well - can you please share if you do see it? 

The leaked script for S2 actually starts from the end of Ep30, indicating S1 was originally intended to end with Xiao Yao's assassination and being brought to the ocean for healing. I am not as certain right now that the fireflies behind Xiang Liu in that scene was meant to indicate his feelings, but it would certainly be interesting to see how the original script actually described that scene. Certainly, in the leaked script, the 37 years under the ocean specifically mentioned the glow of the lovers bug in their hearts in different times and I charted the glow of the lovers bugs based on the script and drama here.  I also compared the leaked script vs the drama of the 37 years healing under the ocean here.

Yes, if I get it I will share it immediately.

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H19279
 solarlunareclipse:
My Brother Is Cang Xuan
In a previous post, we explored the four reasons Xiao Yao gave to justify her refusal to kiss Xiang Liu after she regained her identity as Gao Xing’s eldest princess. Let’s review these reasons:

My brother is Cang Xuan. Xiang Liu is on the opposing side of her family, especially Cang Xuan. Xiao Yao valued Cang Xuan more than her own life, and she adamantly refused even to think about betraying him.
I’m still a girl who dreams. What Xiao Yao wanted most was a lifelong companion who would put her first. This is a role that Xiao Yao knew Xiang Liu was unwilling to play due to his loyalty to Hong Jiang and the Shen Nong Remnant Army. Moreover, Xiao Yao had agreed to a fifteen-year contract with Jing: he vowed to fulfill her dream of lifelong companionship in exchange for not letting another man into her heart.
I’m afraid you’ll walk into my dreams; that might be even scarier than death. Xiao Yao was afraid of falling in love with Xiang Liu, only to have him die on the battlefield and leave her behind. To her, the fear of being abandoned by her lover was even scarier than death.
You’re unsuitable to appear in a girl’s dreams. Xiang Liu’s sometimes cruel and indifferent treatment of Xiao Yao made her insecure about his feelings towards her. She reasoned that even if he did have feelings for her, a ruthless person was incapable of being good to her for her entire life.

I read your two posts related to the reasons that XY declined XY's kiss in chapter 13. I agree with many evidents that you quoted to support your main points. I have no extra comment on first 2 reasons: CX was her brother and she was still a girl who dreamed. I agree with you on these. However, in my opinion, the last 2 reasons can be combined because " you are not suitable to appear in a girl's dream and it's scarier than death" were the explanation for "I am fraid of you'll walk into my dream" 

In your 2nd post, you emphasized on "my gege Cang Xuan" and my get after reading your analysis is this is the most crucial reason. When we analyze the whole novel, the family or political standpoint maybe very important reason that drive the story. However, at the point of chapter 13, I don't think it was that important. Overall for the whole story, I still think XY's idea/obssesion of a having a person who never abandoned her is the most crucial reason that lead to her bad ending with XL.  

I appreciate the analysis from XY's point of view. I have a question to all of you that how XL understood of her reasons when he heard her explanation for not kissing him?

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liddi
 blabla100:
Thank you for this. I always thought that the crystal ball was also a submission from her part to XL's life choices, but I couldn't figured out why than the last question was so painful for her to answer, nothing made much sense. Now reading your interpretation, it seems so obvious. 

I find the last question especially poignant because:

- He wanted to give her someone who can always be with her for her lifetime, knowing that that person was not him. He already had his answer about whom she was willing to marry, and he could have stopped right there. However, because he understood her appeal and what it implied, that she was willing to settle for temporary companionship with him, he needed to know, both for himself and her, whom she truly wanted most to spend that lifetime with. Her refusal to answer was an answer in itself, because it told him who that person was, and why she could not, would not answer. And that knowledge was both a source of pain and comfort to him.

- The one she truly wanted to spend her lifetime with was him, but she knew it was an impossible wish, so she would not allow herself to even consider that question. She was willing to settle for a short-lived time with him despite knowing that one day he would leave her for good, but he would not even give her that, and destroyed every hope, however faint, of that ever happening, even as Fangfeng Bei. It speaks to the amount of courage it must have cost her to have made that appeal to him in the first place, notwithstanding the fact that she would have had to face her greatest fear of being abandoned at the end, and my heart aches immeasurably for her because of it.

In the end, when the day she dreaded finally came, her outburst told us exactly what she kept in her heart:

Xiao Yao's face blanched. Her body trembled uncontrollably but she continued to lie to herself, murmuring, "I'm fine! I have long been mentally prepared... When I first met him, I already knew this day would come. I've always known!"

Xiao Yao murmured, "Even though I kept warning myself that he was Cang Xuan's enemy, I... I was not prepared after all! How I wish it was all just a lie... He is so cunning, he could find a way to survive if he wanted to!"

Jing remained silent, knowing Xiao Yao did not need his response.

"It is exactly because he is so cunning that he did not want to stay alive! He once told me, 'Actually, for a general, the best outcome is to die on the battlefield.' He chose the best outcome for himself!"

"What best outcome? He is the world's greatest fool! He did right by Hong Jiang and all his dead brothers-in-arms, but did he do right by himself?"

"I am the fool! He did not care at all, so why should I be sad? I don't want to be sad..."

Xiao Yao cried as she talked until her words gradually trailed off. In the end, she curled up in Jing’s arms, staring at the towering poinciana trees in silence. Crimson blooms fell one by one, scattered by the wind, like frame upon frame of a past that was lost. No matter how glorious and beautiful they once were, they would all disappear with the wind.

Xiao Yao closed her eyes wearily. “Jing, I want to leave!“

-- Vol 3 Ch18  (Chapter 51)

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HeadInTheClouds
 solarlunareclipse:
I think I read about a Tong Hua interview somewhere that said XY's character growth is supposed to happen after the end of the novel, which doesn't make for the most satisfying character development arc.

It would be great to see that TH's interview. Eons ago I wrote a piece on XY and her relationships with Jing and XL as an allegory for her healing journey. In that context, XL's death was a catalyst for XY to seek real healing/change. It's just that reading the story as it is, XY's minimal growth is super frustrating. 


 solarlunareclipse:
That said, for me, I find that judging XY too harshly takes away from my personal enjoyment of the work. This is why I choose to overlook/rationalize her engaging in infidelity

I was not expecting my comment about XY's impaired judgement and moral standard in this specific instant to spiral into a discussion about whether fidelity/adultery is justifiable. This thread never failed to surprise and entertained me :-). I even looked up the word moral to make sure I was using the right term. Maybe I should have specified her behaviour as hypocritical and selfish as it was about her gain and she didn't consider or didn't care how it affected another person (FFYY in this case). Nevertheless, one instance of shitty behaviour doesn't make someone a bad person. If I write off characters the minute that they did something shitty, I will have no books/dramas left to consume. XY is not the kind of character I prefer for numerous reasons; the things that I enjoy about her are outweighed by those that I don't. It's a shame since I find WYL interesting (I quite like characters that are damaged and unconventional) with a lot of potential to develop into a compelling character, but once she became XY it derailed :-(. Where was her sass, her spunk and fighting spirit? They barely existed anymore. Bloody sad.


 solarlunareclipse:
As for her not being firm enough in choosing XL, I support her decision not to choose XL before 37 years because I believe her main reason for doing this was because she put her own desires aside in order to support CX

XY's not choosing XL is understandable. Trauma or no, she's free to make the choices that she thinks best suit her needs. Although I don't think it was really about CX - at least not solely or even the primary reason. If that was the case, there really was no need for Jing and the 15 years pact. Her relationship with Jing was very much about her needs and she invested a lot into making it work because she really wanted what he promised her. It's not about blame, I said eons ago that I don't blame either one for the way their relationship turned out, I just don't agree with the idea that it was XL who didn't give them a chance and he made a unilateral decision. XY's initial choice impacted the trajectory of their relationship and impacted XL's choices. 


 solarlunareclipse:
I also understand when other readers (not necessarily you) choose to view XL as a perfect, selfless character and XY being this hopelessly selfish and damaged character who is completely undeserving of his love

It's not necessarily that XL is perfect and XY underserving, but that at time it comes across as really unbalanced. One side could barely commit while the other side sacrifice and suffered too much. It was never explicitly stated, but the implications are there. After a while it just came across as sadistic, emotional torture with XL as the whipping boy. Observing the relationship, I just want him to abort because he deserved so much more than what he was getting. 

I keep hopping on and off the ship depending on my interpretation of XY - sometimes I feel really sorry for her and feel sad that things didn't work out for them. Other times I just want to bark at her to put her big girl panties on and freaking show firmness and commitment.

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liddi
 windiaaa041293:
"Lost You Forever 3": Only by reflecting on the past can we live better in the present.

The following is a slightly different translation of what Tong Hua said:

Lost You Forever 3: Only by reflecting on the past can one lead a better life in the present

Author Network reporter: "Lost You Forever3: Boundless Yearning" has been published, and the Lost You Forever series has finally reached its conclusion. After months of anticipation, readers cannot wait to see this "perfect ending". Do you think that the readers would be satisfied with this ending? To you, can the conclusion of this story be considered to be perfect / satisfying?

Tong Hua: I don't know! Based on past experience, it is hard to please everyone, some will be satisfied, while others will not be. I don't know how to evaluate this ending. To me, stories always give the feeling of "temporarily coming to an end", because stories can only end at a certain point, while in my heart, they are all organic, their lives continuing on in that world, just that I would no longer write about it.

This is in line with what she posted on Weibo years ago:

#Talking about Yearning during QiXi# Let's start off with this topic. Actually, the conclusion of every story is not the real ending of those characters. On this topic, I am a very unrealistic person. I always feel that the story is just a chapter in their lives. Even though my story has ended, their lives will continue in another dimension, so the true ending cannot be found in any story.

-- Tong Hua, 13 Aug 2013

and also how she responded when a reader wished to know whether Meng Jue of "Song of the Desert" really died or not. She said she did not know, but she hoped that he did and one day they would meet again many years down the road. 

While what she said should only apply to those who were still alive at the end, we might also assume that perhaps, somewhere, somehow, Xiang Liu managed to survive, or managed to be resurrected, and that maybe, just maybe, he and Xiao Yao would meet again...

I need the remaining two books - the prequel to LYF for more of Xiang Liu at a time when he was alive and well, and the 4th novel, if only for a sliver of hope that we might see him again after the events of LYF...

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AH

Once again I find myself listening to a song and imagining it being sung in a YaoLiu context. 

In this case, this song is stuck in my head and I can't help picturing it as a song sung inside Xiao Yao's heart, in a scenario where she was brave enough to fully acknowledge to herself her feelings for XL in the days after she sent the ice crystal ball to him, and where she was truly prepared to leave everything behind to run away with him. That doesn't quite match up with how I view XY's mindset in chapter 31. So this is basically an AU scenario for me. 

Original Lyrics
Translated Lyrics
Underlying AU XY Thoughts
Mon amour

Dis-moi à quoi tu penses

Si tout ça a un sens

Désolé si j'te dérange
My love

Tell me what you're thinking

If all of this makes sense

Sorry if I (have) disturb(ed) you		I've just sent you a letter to tell you that I'll be marrying Feng Long in two months, along with an ice crystal ball that conveys my feelings and asks you to turn away from your current path. To turn and face me. To take my extended hand. To give me a reason to not marry Feng Long.

I know this might not make any sense given the path you've chosen thus far, and I'm sorry for disturbing you / interrupting you while you are with the remnant army, but I had to ask.

So please answer me and tell me your thoughts. Was it crazy to ask you to choose me?
Mon amour

Te souviens-tu de nous?

Du premier rendez-vous?

C'était beau, c'était fou
My love

Do you remember us?

Our first rendez-vous?

It was beautiful, it was crazy		Do you remember our time together in Qingshui town? Those early days?

Adversaries exchanging poison, torment and pain. Confidantes sharing vulnerability and beautiful moments.

That time was beautiful. That time was crazy.
Je t'aime

J'sais pas pourquoi

Je rejoue la scène

Et c'est toujours la même fin qui recommence		I love you

I don't know why

I replay the scene

But it's always the same ending that keeps repeating		I don't know why I can't convince my heart to see reason. Despite all the reasons I know I shouldn't, and all my efforts not to, I love you.

The inevitable end of your current path replays in my mind, over and over. Either you will kill CX or CX will kill you, and I will be left heartbroken and alone, reeling once again from the death of someone I love.
Tu n'entends pas ma peine?

On en fait quoi?

Est-ce que tu m'aimes?

Ou pas?		Can you not hear/understand my pain?

What (will) we make of it?

Do you love me?

Or not?		Can't you see how your current path will end? The pain it wll cause me?

Can we change our fate and choose a different path? One where we're together and no one has to die?

Do you love me, as I love you? Can you choose life? Can you choose love?
Mon amour

Je ferai tout ce que je peux

Un océan dans le feu

L'impossible si tu le veux		My love

I'll do all that I can

Create an ocean in the fire

The impossible if you want me to		I'm ready to go all-in. To commit to you. To leave everything else behind.

Escape the merciless, scorching fire that is this never-ending war (that offers nothing but pain and death) and exchange it for the cool peace of the ocean (a true home for both of us where we can both thrive).

Leaving our loyalties and identities behind and escaping this star-crossed fate seems impossible. But if you want it, I'll do everything I can to make it happen.
Oh, mon amour

Allez, reviens à Paris

Fais-le pour nous, je t'en supplie

Je le promets, j'ai compris		Oh my love

Please come back to Paris

Do it for us, I am begging you

I promisе, I learned my lesson		Please leave the army in Qingshui town and come back to me. Run away with me. For me. For us.

I tried to play it safe. To shield my heart against you. To not fall for you. To listen to my family. To have a relationship with someone else. I failed, utterly, and I've learned my lesson. I'm ready to risk it all with you. 
Chorus
Chorus
-
Chorus
Chorus
-
Dis-moi l'endroit

Je t'attendrai

Et si tu viens pas

Je t'attendrai		Tell me the place,

I'll wait for you

And if you don't come,

I'll wait for you		I'll wait for your answer in a place where you've come for me before. A place I know you can come again.

And if you don't come, I'll keep waiting. Day in and day out, for seven days, I'll wait for you and your answer.
C'est bête, je sais

Je le ferai

Remplis d'espoir

Je t'attendrai		It's foolish, I know

(but) I'll do it

Filled with hope,

I'll wait for you		Even though I know I'm a fool for asking and waiting, I'll still do it. I'll wait and hope against hope that you'll come to me. That you'll choose me. 
Chorus
Chorus
-
Chorus
Chorus
-
Est-ce que tu m'aimes?

Est-ce que tu m'aimes?

Est-ce que tu m'aimes?

Est-ce que tu m'aimes?

Ou pas?
Do you love me?

Do you love me?

Do you love me?

Or not?
I'm waiting for your answer.

This is the last time I'll ask.

Do you love me? Can you choose me?

Or not?
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liddi

The foreshadowing of things to come... 

Xiao Yao fell silent for a while, then casually said, “Jing knows you are Xiang Liu now. He won’t tell my Gege, but if Feng Long finds out, Gege will definitely know.  You... be careful.”

Xiang Liu stared at Xiao Yao who avoided his gaze and asked, “Who is the old man selling donkey meat?” 

“He used to be under Chi Chen’s command, a survivor of the final battle at Ji Province. Continuing to live with the memories of all his comrades who perished, he might as well have died.” Xiang Liu smiled. “Actually, for a general, the best ending is to die on the battlefield.”

It was clearly a warm Summer night, but Xiao Yao felt her entire body turn cold.

Upon arriving at Little Yan Zhuan’s residence, Xiang Liu and Xiao Yao both stopped at the same time, yet one did not depart while the other did not go in. They just stood there silently.

In the past, she used to feel they had so many opportunities to see each other, but it was not clear when it began that Xiao Yao started to feel that each meeting was one meeting less. By this night, the feeling had become even more evident.

After some time, Xiang Liu said, “Just go in!”

Xiao Yao kept feeling that there were things she wanted to say, but when she tried to think it through, she could not tell what it was. She said, “Things are no longer the same as before. It is best for you to come to the Central Plains less often.”

Xiao Yao thought Xiang Liu would mock her, whether she was worried that Cang Xuan would kill him, or that he would kill Cang Xuan. However, to her surprise, Xiang Liu said nothing, merely continued to look at her.

Xiao Yao quietly waited, but she did not know what exactly she was waiting for.

Xiang Liu’s cold voice sounded, “Just go in!”

With a smile, Xiao Yao curtsied to Xiang Liu then turned to knock on the door. The door creaked open and Xiao Yao stepped inside. When she turned around, Xiang Liu was still standing outside, white robed black hair, extremely refined and elegant, yet like the white waters and black mountains of the North, even when the mountain flowers were in full bloom, there was a lingering sense of desolation.

Unable to take another step, Xiao Yao stood rooted in place staring at Xiang Liu until the door slowly closed and Xiang Liu disappeared from sight.

-- Vol 2 Ch12  (Chapter 29)

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liddi
 AH :
In this case, this song is stuck in my head and I can't help picturing it as a song sung inside Xiao Yao's heart, in a scenario where she was brave enough to fully acknowledge to herself her feelings for XL in the days after she sent the ice crystal ball to him, and where she was truly prepared to leave everything behind to run away with him.

Thank you very much for sharing the song and its translation, and how seamlessly you tied in the YaoLiu perspective into it. While it is not exactly my view of Xiao Yao's frame of mind at the time, it is a very compelling one within the context of the song itself.

Regardless of what Xiao Yao hoped - whether it was for him to take her away either to join him as Xiang Liu or lead a life away from everyone they knew, or to stay in the mortal realm with her as Fangfeng Bei - it joins the long list of what-ifs, which we will never see come to pass since Tong Hua had determined it would never happen, because Xiang Liu would not let Xiao Yao take that path even though he really wanted to take her hand too.

Fine raindrops fell gently on his palm, condensing into cold mist around the ice crystal, making the blue waves shimmer like the ocean under a moonlit night.

The blue ocean depths, tranquil and serene, the mermaid sitting on her beautiful seashell home, hand outstretched as if to beckon or to plead. However, the merman just gazed coldly out at the world beyond the ocean.

Xiang Liu stared at the ice crystal globe in his palm for a long, long time.

Slowly, he extended a finger towards the mermaid’s outstretched hand and his finger touched the ice crystal.

It appeared as if they were holding hands, but in truth the ice crystal separated them and they were in two completely different worlds, never truly able to hold each other’s hands.

-- Vol 2 Ch14  (Chapter 31)

This is one of the times when I truly ache for Xiao Yao, to have found the courage within herself to actively pursue what she wanted and allow herself to be vulnerable for once, only to receive the coldest, harshest of responses.

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