Pretty empty...

Well, here goes another typical korean bl under the belt! Nice production value, warm and rather beautiful cinematography, zero chemistry and a lot of lipstick. A lot!

Jazz For Two was one of the first webtoons I ever read a couple of years ago and I remember liking it a lot. The art was pretty, the story gripping and I even found a playlist on Spotify featuring every song mentioned in the webtoon. What I do not remember is the plot just that it was about two boys in high school bonding over jazz!

The drama is another superficial bl romance koreans are known to produce. It touches upon serious issues but it never tackles them in depth. And issues here were many: homophobia, suicide, bullying, assault. The way to deal with these issues? Love, of course! Love, which magically cures mental problems, behavioural problems etc. etc.

Teens are still children, exploring the world and figuring themselves out, so their reactions towards anything outside the instilled norms may turn violent. Care and kindness are not necessarily the standard. They are scared of being different, to stand out and therefore, when faced with the unknown, they tend to reject it violently! This was shown relly clearly in this drama.

The main characters are four boys in an arts high school who eventually form two enemies-to-lovers couples. The actors were correct, the best being Song Han Gyom(3rd lead) who played DoYoon. The worst by far, Kim Jin Kwon(ML). I had trouble recognizing him even though I remember him from To My Star. The costume and make up designers created an unlikable image: oversized clothes and too much make up (nobody has such red shiny lips naturally: he looked really artificial). Moreover, he had no chemistry with his partner.

I would like to end just with one question: is there such a thing as korean drama taking place in high school but with absolutely no bullying?

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Butterflies inducing hope

Practically perfect in every way!

A butterflies inducing, tears of rage provoking story of two lost men who find happiness and solution in each other's company, with love being the cherry on the top! One, Hiro, is a programmer convinced by his boss(workplace bullying/harassment) that he is incompetent and therefore putting more and more effort into ungrateful work. So much so that he is completely exhausted and drawing onto his last drops of strength. The other one, Kai, is a taciturn man used to being alone and always abandoned, expecting nothing from the world. When these two meet, their worlds slowly but surely start to change and merge, almost unwittingly!

The drama is full of romance tropes: opposites attract, childhood connection but it works perfectly well here. The actors have good chemistry and the evolution of their relationship is slow but steady, with their respective insecurities taking turns in blocking it. Misunderstandings appear but are solved immediately! There was only one problem I found in the first episode: in order to help him sleep, Kai "helps" him release the stress through a handjob which can be seen as SA since Hiro keeps saying No. He does sleep well afterwards but this scene just repeats the aggressive gay man stereotype! I thought we were beyond this!

Kudos to casting director who found young actors who resemble the main actors. I find this often in j dramas: more often than in other countries' ones! They really make it an issue of finding a believable looking young counterparts.

And of course there is food: what would a japanese drama be without it? Love goes through the stomach, everyone knows that!

The opening credits are actually the "happily ever after" sort of compilation of scenes we never really see since the drama stops when they get together.

It is a great watch. Japanese have done it again! Except for the weird title...

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Twists and turns: unexpected!

I usually start a review with a short synopsis but anything I may say can be a spoiler and for the first time ever, I want to keep a review spoiler free. You just need to watch it and enjoy the ride with a satisfactory conclusion!

I have yet to watch a c drama which has a sense of a cliffhanger. Usually they do not practice this art form! Therefore, it came as a huge surprise when practically every episode ended with a twisty sort of cliffhanger. What is even more surprising is that they managed to do it with short, 10 min episodes! Extraordinary!

The story deals with time travel, reincarnation, entertainment industry and mental health. The writing is top notch! I would like to know who wrote this and if they wrote anything else. Because this is by far the most original, interesting and gripping short c drama I have ever watched! Music is the usual c drama songs, heavy on the flute and the cinematography is adequately windy and flowery.

There is romance, there is comedy, there is mystery here! It is easily bingeable! If I have any complaints about this drama is that most of the cast is bland, charisma free except for the actor playing the FL's father: he was somehow different from others, rather remarkable! The drama and the story are definitely worth your while!

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Gruff + brawn = sunset cuteness overload

I have watched too many korean dramas. So much so I recognize the usual tropes and know their outcome. The problem is, I have been applying the same logic to japanese dramas. And have been repeatedly surprised. But still, I keep expecting the korean style outcome when exes or professional rivals are concerned, which luckily, never come. Japanese romcoms are the only dramas/films where the expected evil/mean antagonist never appears!

This one has been the same. It is a story of a burly mangaka who has no life outside drawing mangas. He is stuck, manga storywise and decides to employ a down-on-her luck women to act out different romance situations. At the same time, he is given custody of his nephew. The three of them first clash and then slowly become a family without realizing it.

Frankly, I almost dropped this a few times: the first being 30min into the first episode when her cringy behaviour was too much to bear for me. I soldiered on when the repetition of romance situation under his control in real life become too immoral for my taste. I kept telling myself: this is a drama, it needs ambiguous and difficult situations in order for the plot to move forward. Fortunately, these two issues disappeared after a few episodes and we are left with usual romcom tropes: the ex who comes back, the mother thinking of taking her son away, a rival mangaka, a stalkerish victim of first fake romance situations. Every time one of these characters showed up, I was filled with feelings of foreboding, expecting a difficult and sad outcome. And every time I was surprised when that did not happen.

There is not one single mean character is japanese romcoms. I love it but I don't think I can ever get used to it.

The cast was perfect: the ML is hottest j actor around, his sexy gruffness is so irresistible. Since it was based on a manga, I was pleasantly surprised that the manga mannerisms and exaggerated grimaces were toned down to a bearable level. The kids were the cutest.

This is a highly bingeable drama, I had a lot of fun watching it. I only wished I remembered that japanese romcoms are the sweetest dramas ever and that nobody is really evil in them: that would have saved me from some unnecessary stress! Just watch it if you need a pick me up!!!!

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Art or life? Choose! Why?

NB: Thank you for the brilliant subs evasive subs!

I discovered rakugo. I never knew it existed and one episode was enough for me to spend an hour on the internet trying to find out as much as I can about this art. And I discovered many interesting things and not only on wikipedia!

First : the lesson! (LOL!)

Rakugo (落語, literally 'story with a fall')[1] is a form of Japanese verbal entertainment, traditionally performed in yose theatres.[2] The lone storyteller (落語家, rakugoka) sits on a raised platform, a kōza (高座). Using only a paper fan (扇子, sensu) and a small cloth (手拭, tenugui) as props, and without standing up from the seiza sitting position, the rakugo artist depicts a long and complicated comical (or sometimes sentimental) story. The story always involves the dialogue of two or more characters. The difference between the characters is depicted only through change in pitch, tone, and a slight turn of the head. The monologue always ends with a narrative stunt (punch line). Rakugo has been described as "a sitcom with one person playing all the parts". Around 1670 in the Edo period (1603–1867), three storytellers appeared who were regarded as the first rakugoka. (wikipedia)

Second: the plot!

This drama was gripping from the first to the last minute! It tells the story of Bou, a young boy whose dancing career had been ruined and who is sent over to a master rakugoka to learn the craft of storytelling. He meets Sukeroku the first day there and they become fast friends in spite of completely opposite characters. The drama tells the story of their lives over a period of 60 years which covers Showa era (from approximately 1933 to 1997 with the epilogue 16yrs later!). The boys change names as they grow and get promoted within the rakugo association.

I used to watch a lot of western dramas with this kind of basic plot: story of one character's life practically from cradle to grave, spanning a long period of history when major changes happened. Since I usually avoid asian historical dramas as if they were plague, I have never seen an asian version of these life stories. I loved this one, it was gripping, but it tugged at my heartstrings too much in the last episode so I shall probably never watch anything like this again. Too painful in spite of them trying to be upbeat about main character dying of old age!

The plot describes the fight, very restrained and civilized, between the holders of the tradition (masters) and those who try to bring a bit to modernity into strictly coded art (Sukeroku). Yakoumo(Bou) is torn between the safety of known rules and codes and the admiration for the freedom and originality of Sakuroku's performance. And even though for a short moment Yakoumo felt jealous of his friend, he quickly accepted that his art is different, classical not as exciting as Sakuroku's but still admirable. The bond between those two people was unbreakable, they loved and cherished each other immensely and no matter what the world thought , they were there for each other. This was a real bromance!

The problems start when Yakoumo falls for a geisha. When his master asks him to choose between her and rakugo, he breaks up with her. She consoles herself with Sukeroku who was banished from rakugo for insubordination and everything leads to a tragedy with consequences felt for a long time afterwards. This was never really a love triangle and they showed it clearly. The rules and hidden envies ruined lives of three people who starting from that moment just survived and not lived.

The plot is tightly woven and there are no plot holes. The characters are clearly presented and they are fully fleshed out: we follow their growth over a long time period.

Third: the production.

Since this drama is a life story, there are a lot of time jumps so the extraordinary actor, Okada Masaki, first and foremost, had to play the character between the ages of 17 and 70 which is a no mean treat. The way he changed voice and posture and attitude with age is impressive. The actors also had to learn all the rakugo tales and codes of performance as well. Amazing. The only problem i had was the ageing make up (which was expertly done, no details were missed- like hands or neck.): the character who is supposed to be 70 looks more like he's 95, he looks too old for his age. Maybe it has to do with the personality of the character: dry, succinct, cold, unhappy, bitter, restrained so he looks older than he should?
The music is just perfect, with enough pathos to tug at your heart. The time period was rather faithfully recreated.

Conclusion

Drama is about rakugo, an art form thought to be on the decline but still alive and kicking and the people preforming it. it is about people in doing rakugo. As I said, I'd never heard of rakugo before this drama, but it is still easy to follow since it is a human story. Beautifully told story of people trying to overcome obstacles put before them by society, rules and prejudice. Sorry, this review is a bit messy...

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I started this story three times: somehow the boys' acting in the first half of the first episode failed to grab my attention. So I forced myself to continue watching, and suddenly I was hooked. Though the acting was still pretty bad, I liked this story a lot!

This is one of the more complex and intriguing stories in My Universe collection. It follows two brothers, inseparable fraternal twins who are growing up and starting to drift apart. Kun is the serious, studious and more intelligent brother. More mature as well, used to his happy-go-lucky brother's attitude and the lack of drive and seriousness, Kun is getting impatient to live his own life without trying to always accommodate his brother's desires. The arrival of Tod in their high school will reveal the tension in the twins' relationship and bring it to the breaking point. While Korn is trying to keep his brother glued to himself, Kun only wishes to get a bit of breathing space away from him. And even though it is hard for him, to stay away from his brother too, he realizes that it is a right decision that will allow them to have their own lives!

This is not a japanese drama so I never thought they would go the incest way as the cover image may suggest. They are just brothers, close and loving each other like brothers. No more no less! There is a beginning of a possible romance(Kun & Tod) which does not pan out. But that is not important. The accent here is put squarely on the twins' relationship and their personal growth and development. There is a mini drama involving Pond, a tutor and Korn which was eventually just brushed off. There should have been more serious consequences shown: and an apology is not enough in my book. But maybe the teens are more resilient today and get over traumatic events faster? They should not have introduced this side story as it was not treated correctly. There was enough material for the plot to stay focused on the twins' relationship!

The acting was bad in the beginning but it eventually turned all right. Those young actors definitely needed a few more acting lessons: the story demanded a lot more than standing and looking pretty like in some of the other stories (Fake Love, I'm looking at you!). They tried their best and what they did was correct but...

The title is very smart: Pisces means fish and is as well an astrological sign for those born in March as the boys seem to be. The boys keep a couple of fish in their bedroom called Left and Right and one of the boys is right handed while the other one is lef handed. I don't know if they did it on purpose or it is just the casting accident but it fits extremely well with the whole theme of the story. Pisces also resembles a lot to "pieces" as the boys seem to be two pieces of a whole, or two sides of the same coin ...

Pisces of Me is definitely worth the watch and is probably one of the best stories in this series. And not one single flashback (Fake Love, I'm looking at you!)! LOL

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Wrong timing!

I have mixed feelings about this one! While I liked the first half, the strong, cheeky and no nonsense woman, thinking about herself first and telling us about it by breaking the fourth wall, the second half was a typical K drama where the same woman decides that she actually wants to be a cliché. The man goes the opposite way: when he meets her he is a cliché, he wants to date her but once they start dating, he takes stock of his life and realizes that the marriage is not for him. He actually becomes what she was in the beginning.
This drama special had the promise of being really special but it crashed and burned. The development of the female character is disappointing: she became a typical k drama FL in love, asking for something that was not offered anymore. Eventually, at least, she got her brain back but it was too late!

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Not for the fainthearted

Recently, I've been complaining about the onslaught of insipid fluff, passing for BLs, that Japanese have been sending our way and regretting the good old times of the last year when their BLs were outstanding mostly!

And then I watched this. And, oh boy, was I served! More than I ever asked for! This was dark, gritty, cruel, depressing, thought-provoking, disturbing and more! Completely unexpected.

The story of two completely broken people trying so hard to survive in the awful surroundings is extremely difficult to watch! This is everything but a BL (except for the last episode!);it's a psychological crime drama where the main characters happen to be gay. They were both cruelly abandoned by their own families and are forced to do anything and everything in order to survive.

How do you stay hopeful in such a desperate situation? They are barely keeping their heads above the water, hanging on, still wanting to survive in spite of everything,

It was expertly filmed, the atmosphere was sufficiently heavy and menacing, the empty side streets, the garbage, the neon signs - everything on screen was dehumanizing and hopeless, hell on earth. And still, they want to live! The hope that never dies! The music, heavy, adds to the overall feeling of banging your head agains the wall!
The acting is amazing: the blond guy does not change much, he is outgoing and somehow optimistic, but he is so thin that he looks sick! The other actor does not show much feeling before the ending, he is practically dead inside but spending time with the blond guy, he allows himself to feel.

This drama was awful and I almost regret watching it. But at the same time it shows the filth behind the shiny signs and pretty clothes. Most of all, it criticizes the Family and the whole society that is turning a blind eye to people suffering.

It was very hard to watch: I could not believe that they put certain scenes involving children, in this drama. I hope those child actors are taken care of by psychologists!

HOTE gets lighter only in the last episode and goes full BL: they meet again after a time jump and everything is so nice and they live happily ever after.....

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Badass Bunny and her recent article are to blame for me loving this drama.I will be forever grateful to her for making me discover it. This drama definitely has its flaws but I do not really remember the last time I enjoyed a K drama so much. Maybe The Forbidden Marriage over a year ago? Anyhow, that is the one K drama which pops up in my head when I try to remember any!

The story is based on japanese manga and drama which I dropped after the first episode. And even though I found the japanese FL cuter and more charming, I just could not watch that animé manga overacting and excessive grimacing. So when I started this one, I did not expect much. I thought I'd give it one episode and drop it. The next day I had three episodes left! I got hooked immediately. The story is basically the same but the Koreans toned down the manga and made characters more or less ordinary humans.

I was particularly impressed by the ML's character: he was surprisingly decent and realistic and very smart, where you'd expect someone hugely talented to be arrogant and obnoxious to others. God knows I don't like the actor playing him (I dropped every drama of his I ever started!) but here he was perfect as a handsome and talented pianist and wannabee conductor. I liked how he grows from a loner to a person surrounded by friends, how he opened up and became more approachable under the FL's influence. But what I liked the most was his lack of ego, willingness to do anything to achieve his goals, his warmth behind the brash exterior. I liked how unexpectedly down to earth he was.

His character changes when he meets the FL, a quirky piano prodigy living in a pigsty. While trying to sort her out, it is actually she who sorts him out. She is loud, without a filter, colourful, easy going and completely unconscious of other people. In contact with the ML she gradually changes, calms down a bit and becomes less childish. She grows as a character as well. Surprisingly, I did not find her annoying as I should have: the childishness from the beginning was limit unbearable. And still, I was not annoyed by her. The actress did a great job finding the right balance.

I loved the music. The actors "played" their instruments convincingly except for the violin player who was obviously struggling! I loved every support character: from the rivals-to-lovers pair of violin players, to a gay timpani player to Mini Min Hee a poor always hungry student whose instrument is twice her size! Kudos to the producers because they managed to keep the quintessential japanese drama spirit in as much as there are no really evil character though a few showed promise but they turned out to be just sheep in wolves' clothes and eventually be good and just!

What I did not like:
- Franz character: first he is completely over the top and then the actor is unconvincing in this role. This character was supposedly adopted to Germany as a child and can barely speak Korean. That lasts the airport run: he tries to speak slowly with an accent but a few episodes in, he speaks a perfect Korean only to lose it in the last episodes.
- somewhat predictable plotlines in the second part: both main characters have childhood traumas which, of course, act up when they should not.
- noble idiocy and the breakup for" your own good" are so useless
- SLS for a few episodes
- why did they wait for the closing credits of the last episode to have her play the piano with his orchestra. There were so many occasions throughout the drama when that could have solved many problems....

I enjoyed watching this immensely.

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Gentle giant & Scaredy cat

Unfortunately this is a very low budget production: they must have filmed it in producer's office!
Fortunately, this again goes to prove that you don't need loads of money if you have a good story and a good writer.

Unfortunately there is the height difference.
Fortunately, the gentle giant is cute.

Unfortunately the cat is 32 year old virgin who does not know what he wants. Such a typical situation for an asian drama. He has a crush on the giant but when he asks him out, he choses to misunderstand!
Fortunately the giant knows that so he starts playing hard to get.

Unfortunately the cat is so embarrassingly inexperienced.
Fortunately there is the female coworker teaching him the ropes of dating.

Unfortunately they have zero chemistry.
Fortunately, the gentle giant is rather proactive.
Unfortunately the cat is not.
Fortunately, eventually he needs to be so he is. Hooray!

Unfortunately they did not make this about teenagers. It would have been more convincing. Or would it?
Fortunately, they did not make this about teens it would have been ridiculous. Teens usually jump before thinking. This is the opposite: the cat thinks and then does not jump!

Unfortunately they kept those boring manga tropes like clear distinction between seme and uke roles.
Fortunately the kisses were nice.

Unfortunately this reminded me of She Who Cooks: the same awkward uncomfortable relationship.
Fortunately the guys here seem to get over it by the end.

Fortunately, Nicksden subbed this expertly so we get to enjoy it a lot! Thank you!

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How to lose lifelong friends?

Lie and cheat!

I love messed up characters! And here I was served well and in abundance!

The plot is complicated: three lifelong friends, two men and a woman, meet only occasionally now that they are adults. One man confesses to the other one but is rejected because he does not want to ruin their friendship. On the rebound, the first man accepts the woman's confession. But it does not work. The men end hooking up eventually. The friendship is ruined. The first guy's ex appears and breaks them up.

I watched the cut version and again, it was confirmed to me that in order to follow a story, NC scenes are not necessary. I can get a hint: the heads get closer, lips touch and the next scene is them cuddling in bed....it is up to me to fill in the blanks and it is pretty much obvious!

The production is very, very low budget: sets are limited, colours are pale and cold, there are no extras. But the soundtrack is exceptional: there are some beautiful songs there!

The plot is too much for such a short drama and the second part in particular needed more time to develop. The ex seems like a real psycho only to be shown as cute and end up a coward: too much of an inconsistent character.

Moreover, the subs are not that good so I failed to comprehend what the ex tried to achieve with his last antic: posting a fake story accusing himself of being under influence. I think....

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Love that dares not say its name....

Not as good or as heavy as Skate Our Souls and Side By Side which dealt with serious mental health issues, this instalment of Project S series is a worthy part of it. It deals with the issues of abandonment, violence, self-worth, family pressure, friendship and love through sports. After skateboarding and badminton, it is to volleyball to be put forward as the means of healing and personal growth.

The writing and the acting are stellar as usual but the intensity of the other two series is missing. I am probably watching these out of order (I saw the trailer for SBS at the ending of this drama's final episode!) so the mounting pressure is not there. Spike is more in line with ordinary teen dramas: the angst, the discovery of love and the fragility of friendship are all the usual topics of such dramas.

I needed to keep reminding myself that this was made in 2017 because the bromance was romancing c drama way. Maybe there was a bit of romance there between the boys but it was never openly said. Unless you count as the indication the moment when Puen, the main lead, jokingly says to his best girl friend that the gender is not important for him in love, crushing all her hopes...Am I seeing a BL story where there is none? I am not sure...

I guess I was looking for romance in this one because the mental health issues were not the topic here. Puen had to deal with the abandonment issues since he was little but sports helped him overcome it and gain confidence. This was all explained in a short flashback.

The songs' lyrics did nothing to make me think differently: it was all I love you, you are the most important person, you make me better etc.etc. whenever the scene was about the three particular boys. A burgeoning love triangle if I never saw one...

An excellent drama! I only hated Puen's haircut! The rest is a great watch!

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There were five in a flat....well, almost!

This third season continues the main character's quest for love while sharing a flat with friends. This season is the weakest so far: the new characters are an unlikeable lot, loud, misbehaving and annoying making Zik's life harder but he is resigned to it so he just sighs and rolls his eyes.

After Sammi left, Zik was poised to enjoy the flat all by himself. But the peace was shortlived as Radar came back from abroad with a friend in tow, all mysterious, refusing to explain why he was fired and why is this guy stuck to him. Unfortunately we never get to learn that. There is the annoying and promiscuous neighbour and Zik's university friend, a high school PE teacher claiming to be straight but giving every gay vibe known in the universe. Just like Radar! Knowing he cannot have Radar, Zik starts dating Shawn but that relationship is not bound to last very long since they have nothing in common. Sometimes opposites attract but they are not even that!
The ending is open announcing another, the last, chapter in Zik & Radar's story.

I don't know how realistic this drama is behind all the comedy and mockumentary bits but it seems steeped in reality of contemporary gay scene in HK. The writing is still excellent; the acting is amazing (the long suffering Zik is played to perfection by Pan Zhuo Lun) and I wish I could find more about the actors, not only their first names on youtube! The comedy parts are excellent, the banter is fast and lively but they still haven't found the way to make the transition from sitcom to a serious drama and back, smooth so the change in pace and tone can be jarring. There is not much depth in any of the characters, we do not know much about them or their lives outside the apartment building. But, just like in previous seasons, they touch upon some serious issues like family, the problems in a long-term relationship, teacher/student relationship, drug use...

This whole series was actually a fun watch: the mockumentary parts were the funniest. I hope they make another season in which we will finally find out the outcome of the Zik/Radar relationship!

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Cute & bland & quick

Well, this was underwhelming! This simple and colourless love story between two beauty advisers in a make up store was a forgettable fare.

The plot was simple: a dazzling, confident BA falls for a super kind coworker. One man's kindness blunts the edges off of the cynical and highly talented colleague. Very quickly they start dating and a few minutes later they are living together: the plot moves forward quickly. The conflicts are minor and solved quickly: none involving the society codes but interpersonal relations such as a former coworker or distant family. The relationship is almost ruined by the kind man's lack of self-confidence, but that is sorted out quickly when he is made to understand that he is also highly valued. The last conflict is completely incomprehensible: why does the kind guy dread the handsome guy becoming a model? Is he afraid of being abandoned or he does not want an excellent make up artist waste his talent on modelling? His insecurities moved up a higher gear while suddenly the communication was lacking..the whole conflict was illogical...

The cinematography is bland, soft and somehow lacking in colour and peps. The actors are cute but have minimal to no chemistry: when they were kissing they seemed miles apart.

Cosmetic Playlover (how do they come up with these titles which are senseless, is beyond me!) is a nice quick watch, nothing is messy here, everyone is nice and kind even the people who seem threatening when seen the first time....a typical j drama romance.

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Is it too late?

This should have actually been a comment since there is not much to say about this 2 part special episode which comes right after the ending of the first season. But since this page is quite empty, I said to myself, what the heck and now I am trying to figure out what to write about this special.

The story focuses on Steven, Zik's ex. Meeting Zik a year after they broke up stirs the forgettne feelings in Steven so when Tat(Zik's roommate) leaves, Steven jumps to the occasion and asks Zik for some friends with benefits time at his place. But before they could do anything, Steven's family shows up and what follows is a very uncomfortable family dinner. After being abused by Steven's mother who never liked him during the ten years they spent together, Zik storms out and refuses to talk to Steven anymore. Still horny, Steven turns to online app and hooks up with a random guy but everything they do or say, keeps reminding him of Zik and he eventually ends up just spending the whole night talking to the guy and nothing else realizing that he still loved Zik.

The whole drama still being a sitcom, this special is not void of humour: Steven's bickering family is a treat and the way the hook up guy tries to get Steven excited is priceless. It is a fitting continuation of the story letting us know more about Steven and his relationship with Zik. We already got to take a few glimpses into their life as a couple in the second half of the 1st season, but it was the bad part: here everything is just fluff, cute and loving moments.

Depending on the stage in your life, where you are and who you're with, your memories will reflect that mood: when you're unhappy, you tend to remember the moments of love and happiness while saying, I was happy then, why did I behave in that manner. And vice versa!

Now on to the second season to see what will happen between Zik, Steven and Tat...

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