No, she never told him anything about their previous life
I kind of feel like talking about that with Song Mo would have taken the focus from the "second chance" story and put more emphasis on why and how that happened, which is never a mystery the drama set out to answer?
Just finished watching, this was my first historical cdrama. Really liked it! Any suggestions which i should watch…
Other great costume dramas with strong female leads and the leads as partners and teammates/equals are A Dream Of Splendor, He Who Rules The World, Flourished Peony (part 1)/In The Name Of Blossom (part 2), A New Life Begins, and Love Like The Galaxy.
Cdrama recommendations with bad Emperors? (bcz i find most Emperors in historical cdramas potentially good or…
Well, pretty much all historical Kdramas have bad (or just plain weak) kings, unless they're the ML. You can try some of those! 😅
You're right, Cdramas do tend to do bad kings less often. Maybe it's a censorship thing? I doubt it's because actual empoerors/kings were not bad, haha.
On second thought, Joy Of Life has a shifty emperor. Season 1 keeps you guessing about what he's really like, but by the end of season 2 it slowly becomes clear that he's no good.
This was worth the time. Enjoyed it immensely even though I'll be taking 0.5 off my rating for the utterly pointless…
Did you see Episode 40.5? I watched till halfway through 40 (before the story gets weird 😅) and then skipped to the 5 to 10 minute bonus episode that ends quite satisfyingly (... and with some spiciness, but in the way this drama does spicy, which is with wordplay and subtlety 😅). It makes the ending way more enjoyable! I'm unfortunately no help whatsoever in finding 40.5, but maybe someone on this thread will know? It wasn't officially released with the rest of this drama.
yeah... i just skipped the stupid bits near the end. lol they never happened. with the bonus ep doesn't really…
Yes, stopped it halfway through the last episode (on @ThaliaToo's expert recommendation), and just skipped to Episode 40.5 (too bad it's not posted on streaming sites). Kind of a pain in the neck to find, but the best way to end this properly. 😉
This was lovely! Another great costume drama with a strong female lead and leads that works together as equals in their relationship; similar in this sense to dramas like A New Life Begins, A Dream Of Splendor, Who Rules The World, The Double, Flourished Peony/In The Name Of Blossom, and Love Like The Galaxy. It doesn't have the coziness of A New Life Begins, or the chemistry of A Dream Of Splendor, or the playfulness of He Who Rules The World, the subtlety/twistiness of The Double, nor does it innovate relationally like Flourished Peony or have the scale and scope of Love Like The Galaxy, but it has it's own charms, and I think the word I'd use to describe this drama is "hope." It permeates the story from beginning to end.
I'm not quite sure why the king kept so much close to his chest when things could have been a heck of a lot easier for his loyal people to know more of the scoop... but by the end we can overlook such things.
I'm not sure Li Yin Rui had the onscreen presence and gravitas of some other MLs, but I still really liked his character. I didn't like that the end had more scenes of Song Han than Song Mo, and he got kind of sidelined (I felt) a bit by the end. I always loved Yantang's scenes with Shougu the best. ☺️
The arcs at times were a bit messy and hard to follow, but what I loved most is that our leads built an enduring framework of trust and security through caring deeply for others. Their currency was selflessness, kindness, integrity and compassion, and I loved that these values triumphed in the end. Shougu's tenacity and dedication to achieving flourishing and a second chance for herself and those she loved was matched only by Yantang's persistent integrity and loyalty, and I loved the way they supported each other and grew in trust. It's always so fun to watch two clever people put their heads together--they made quite the pair!
Very much enjoyed this. Highly recommend!
P.S. Song Mo was absolutely stunning in those opening scenes. Totally rocked that gray hair!
Something I've wondered; instead of making Dusik's hangup and hiccup with Hye Jin be about not wanting to share…
True, I think there were some nods to it for sure, I just thought they could have made it a more convincing and emphasized arc than the one one they chose to lean into most.
So does the mother never get better? Because I've only watched 3 episodes before needing a break because her behavior…
Singleness is definitely a guaranteed way to never make mistakes or mess up as a parent. If you never have children, there's no way to parent them badly. I think that's kind of a no-brainer, though?
And I think it's an unsustainable response to parental abuse. Individuals can obviously choose this option, but not whole societies.
My parents weren't perfect, either (because, again, imperfect parents are the only kinds of parents that exist), but I think they did so many things well and always tried their best. I wouldn't be the person I am today (in a good way) without their guidance and wisdom. I genuinely think MOST parents try their best. Their best may not be very good, and for some it's absolutely awful, but most THINK they're trying their best or loving their kids, even when objectively they're not.
One of the responsibilities of adulthood and maturity is to recognize this--that our parents did things imperfectly, poorly or downright badly or immorally--and to take ownership of it by doing our best to heal and grow from ways we were hurt so we don't perpetuate that hurt to others, if possible. Maybe that means never having kids. Maybe that means getting therapy; lots of it. Or maybe it means a bit of both. It will often mean that a relationship with the parent(s) needs to be cut off until/unless that person has fixed their issues. Maybe the distance is permanent. Maybe it means creating boundaries. Everyone's situation looks different as each situation is unique.
My personal opinion is that one reason abuse repeats itself in generations is because people don't deal with the bitterness and hatred and anger towards--and pain/trauma from--their family who wronged them which inevitably (and understandably!) builds up over time; if they don't address it, they gradually turn into someone they never could have imagined becoming: the very thing they hated.
A good friend of mine would get abused by his dad when his dad got angry (and his grandfather had abused his dad, too). One day my friend, when he was a teenager, like 17 or so, noticed his dad sleeping on the couch and felt the anger mount inside him. It grew until he fantasized about bashing his dad's head in with a golf club sitting nearby. After a moment he realized what he was thinking, and was horrified and stunned. It hit him that he was fantasizing harm towards his dad in retribution for his abuse, because he had so much hatred in his heart towards him. But doing so would have made him no different from his father. Because he saw himself becoming the very man he feared, he got help for it, and slowly, slowly learned to forgive his dad (not reconcile with him), who died not long after this happened from an illness. Now that my friend has worked through his bitterness and has learned to forgive his dad over the years (he's told me the bitterness towards him is completely gone), he has ended the cycle of abuse because he does not have violent, unaddressed anger and hatred anymore, and is a wonderful dad to his two daughters.
So I think generational trauma and abuse can end, not just when people don't have children, but when those who got hurt get help, and work through their pain and address it rather than letting the bitterness and hate fester, or pushing it under the carpet or pretending like it didn't happen (and picking a good partner with whom to have children who is trustworthy and won't hurt their kids, either, of course 😏).
I honestly couldn't believe it when it ended just like that. I don't know if they were planning on having a second…
Agreed! I think the drama could have ended with them reuniting as a family again after college and leaving it there. The first 1/3 set the bar too high, I guess. :)
Kind of a crazy reason to censor entertainment that is clearly fantasy in every way. 😅 I still can't wrap my head around it. Why does the government feel responsible for people not being able to separate fact from fiction? Or for parents who should have been the ones to censor what their child could handle watching or not? 🤔
just started this show and it's been good so far, only thing bothering me is the fact that they're gonna end up…
Love in the Moonlight also completely changed history by having a prince who died, survive to become king in the drama (or it was implied he did and that the couple's ending was happy). 😅 Kdramas do that. :)
Did Tong Li Ya have a significant role in this drama? She would be the only reason why I would watch this drama.
She's a significant role, if not a frequent one. She features more in the first half than the second. She's lovely, but her story is kind of heartbreaking, just fyi. 🥺
This and True Beauty, while wildly popular as they aired and still known for being enjoyable dramas, both got…
I know a lot of people love it, they just got frustrated with the love triangle. I can always tell which dramas people love because if it has over 100,000 on MDL, it's a popular drama and many people liked it.
I love talking dramas! That's why I frequent MDL. :) It's fun to hear others' insights, and to connect over seeing similar things, and sometimes get new insights I wouldn't have noticed by myself.
My first Kdrama was Crash Landing On You, and it will also always have a special place in my heart for that reason, too. But my favorite Kdrama screenwriter is actually the screenwriter for Start-Up. I find this to be her most difficult drama to get through (still love it, though), but I love her themes and how she writes really amazing growth arcs for her leads. Her other dramas are (in order from oldest to newest):
Dream High I Can Hear Your Voice (in my top 5) Pinocchio Page Turner (only three episodes) While You Were Sleeping (in my top 2--neck and neck with Dr. Romantic 2) Start-Up Castaway Diva
I'd recommend them all (on MDL, none of these dramas have below an 8, and WYWS has an 8.7 last I checked, which is high for a drama from 2017)! The older ones are a bit dated, but ICHYV and WYWS are both some of my favorite dramas of all time, and I Can Hear Your Voice has my favorite themes and some of my favorite scenes in a Kdrama to date. Both are in my top 5. All of her dramas have love triangles, and all the characters always have flaws to grow from of varying degrees (from insufferable to mild 😅), but she writes the 2MLs as true characters, not just as plot devices to help the main couple grow or get together.
Back to Start-Up, I also thought this screenwriter showed over and over again why Dal Mi picked Do San over Ji Pyeong. I am familiar with the screenwriter's style, so I was prepared for him to be endearing (all her 2MLs are, haha). It was still always agony to see him watch them connect and grow slowly, slowly while he helped them from behind the scenes or without them even knowing, never getting credit for it (hating himself for doing it, then continuing because he truly is a "good boy" 😉, and didn't want to let Ms. Choi down), but Do San and Dal Mi were also a good fit from the get-go. Ji Pyeong's story was also a lot about his relationship with Dal Mi's grandmother. I thought their story was so lovely, even though so many things went off the rails later due to their sweet little scheme of writing Dal Mi letters. I also loved Do San, and watching him fess up to the Olympiad debacle was one of the hardest things to watch in a drama. I always admire his character's courage.
Another big theme of this story: Beware! Lies/dishonesty, even seemingly innocent ones, will never stay hidden... 😅
This and True Beauty, while wildly popular as they aired and still known for being enjoyable dramas, both got…
Yes, but I was fine with him not ending up with her. It worked for Nam Joo Hyuk to not "do as well" because his character is supposed to be a nerdy engineering major who struggles to relate to people and connect; Ji Pyeong is brilliant and talented and had to learn to survive amongst people from a young age with virtually nothing and no one to fall back on, so he's much better at navigating and social situations and challenges than Do San who had middle class privilege to keep him afloat as he chased his dreams glued to his computer. 😅
I thought Ji Pyeong's growth was interesting as a character apart from Dal Mi, and it was so fun l (AND painful 😅) to watch both male leads grow.
Ji Pyeong grew into someone who knew how to trust others, and show love towards them rather than bottle his feelings up and hide them deep down inside, and Do San learned how to "ride off without a map," finally finding another person he could work side by side with him who cared about following their dreams, too, even when everyone around them said it was stupid to do so.
And both had to learn how to be their true selves; pretty much every character had to learn that integrity and truth-telling is essential to building trust and solid relationships, and the foundation for lasting success of any kind.
You're right, Cdramas do tend to do bad kings less often. Maybe it's a censorship thing? I doubt it's because actual empoerors/kings were not bad, haha.
On second thought, Joy Of Life has a shifty emperor. Season 1 keeps you guessing about what he's really like, but by the end of season 2 it slowly becomes clear that he's no good.
I'm not quite sure why the king kept so much close to his chest when things could have been a heck of a lot easier for his loyal people to know more of the scoop... but by the end we can overlook such things.
I'm not sure Li Yin Rui had the onscreen presence and gravitas of some other MLs, but I still really liked his character. I didn't like that the end had more scenes of Song Han than Song Mo, and he got kind of sidelined (I felt) a bit by the end. I always loved Yantang's scenes with Shougu the best. ☺️
The arcs at times were a bit messy and hard to follow, but what I loved most is that our leads built an enduring framework of trust and security through caring deeply for others. Their currency was selflessness, kindness, integrity and compassion, and I loved that these values triumphed in the end. Shougu's tenacity and dedication to achieving flourishing and a second chance for herself and those she loved was matched only by Yantang's persistent integrity and loyalty, and I loved the way they supported each other and grew in trust. It's always so fun to watch two clever people put their heads together--they made quite the pair!
Very much enjoyed this. Highly recommend!
P.S. Song Mo was absolutely stunning in those opening scenes. Totally rocked that gray hair!
And I think it's an unsustainable response to parental abuse. Individuals can obviously choose this option, but not whole societies.
My parents weren't perfect, either (because, again, imperfect parents are the only kinds of parents that exist), but I think they did so many things well and always tried their best. I wouldn't be the person I am today (in a good way) without their guidance and wisdom. I genuinely think MOST parents try their best. Their best may not be very good, and for some it's absolutely awful, but most THINK they're trying their best or loving their kids, even when objectively they're not.
One of the responsibilities of adulthood and maturity is to recognize this--that our parents did things imperfectly, poorly or downright badly or immorally--and to take ownership of it by doing our best to heal and grow from ways we were hurt so we don't perpetuate that hurt to others, if possible. Maybe that means never having kids. Maybe that means getting therapy; lots of it. Or maybe it means a bit of both. It will often mean that a relationship with the parent(s) needs to be cut off until/unless that person has fixed their issues. Maybe the distance is permanent. Maybe it means creating boundaries. Everyone's situation looks different as each situation is unique.
My personal opinion is that one reason abuse repeats itself in generations is because people don't deal with the bitterness and hatred and anger towards--and pain/trauma from--their family who wronged them which inevitably (and understandably!) builds up over time; if they don't address it, they gradually turn into someone they never could have imagined becoming: the very thing they hated.
A good friend of mine would get abused by his dad when his dad got angry (and his grandfather had abused his dad, too). One day my friend, when he was a teenager, like 17 or so, noticed his dad sleeping on the couch and felt the anger mount inside him. It grew until he fantasized about bashing his dad's head in with a golf club sitting nearby. After a moment he realized what he was thinking, and was horrified and stunned. It hit him that he was fantasizing harm towards his dad in retribution for his abuse, because he had so much hatred in his heart towards him. But doing so would have made him no different from his father. Because he saw himself becoming the very man he feared, he got help for it, and slowly, slowly learned to forgive his dad (not reconcile with him), who died not long after this happened from an illness. Now that my friend has worked through his bitterness and has learned to forgive his dad over the years (he's told me the bitterness towards him is completely gone), he has ended the cycle of abuse because he does not have violent, unaddressed anger and hatred anymore, and is a wonderful dad to his two daughters.
So I think generational trauma and abuse can end, not just when people don't have children, but when those who got hurt get help, and work through their pain and address it rather than letting the bitterness and hate fester, or pushing it under the carpet or pretending like it didn't happen (and picking a good partner with whom to have children who is trustworthy and won't hurt their kids, either, of course 😏).
And this one seems like her wildest, boldest premise yet!
And Suzy, while I've loved her in some dramas, seems hit or miss depending on who directs what she's in...
I love talking dramas! That's why I frequent MDL. :) It's fun to hear others' insights, and to connect over seeing similar things, and sometimes get new insights I wouldn't have noticed by myself.
My first Kdrama was Crash Landing On You, and it will also always have a special place in my heart for that reason, too. But my favorite Kdrama screenwriter is actually the screenwriter for Start-Up. I find this to be her most difficult drama to get through (still love it, though), but I love her themes and how she writes really amazing growth arcs for her leads. Her other dramas are (in order from oldest to newest):
Dream High
I Can Hear Your Voice (in my top 5)
Pinocchio
Page Turner (only three episodes)
While You Were Sleeping (in my top 2--neck and neck with Dr. Romantic 2)
Start-Up
Castaway Diva
I'd recommend them all (on MDL, none of these dramas have below an 8, and WYWS has an 8.7 last I checked, which is high for a drama from 2017)! The older ones are a bit dated, but ICHYV and WYWS are both some of my favorite dramas of all time, and I Can Hear Your Voice has my favorite themes and some of my favorite scenes in a Kdrama to date. Both are in my top 5. All of her dramas have love triangles, and all the characters always have flaws to grow from of varying degrees (from insufferable to mild 😅), but she writes the 2MLs as true characters, not just as plot devices to help the main couple grow or get together.
Back to Start-Up, I also thought this screenwriter showed over and over again why Dal Mi picked Do San over Ji Pyeong. I am familiar with the screenwriter's style, so I was prepared for him to be endearing (all her 2MLs are, haha). It was still always agony to see him watch them connect and grow slowly, slowly while he helped them from behind the scenes or without them even knowing, never getting credit for it (hating himself for doing it, then continuing because he truly is a "good boy" 😉, and didn't want to let Ms. Choi down), but Do San and Dal Mi were also a good fit from the get-go. Ji Pyeong's story was also a lot about his relationship with Dal Mi's grandmother. I thought their story was so lovely, even though so many things went off the rails later due to their sweet little scheme of writing Dal Mi letters. I also loved Do San, and watching him fess up to the Olympiad debacle was one of the hardest things to watch in a drama. I always admire his character's courage.
Another big theme of this story: Beware! Lies/dishonesty, even seemingly innocent ones, will never stay hidden... 😅
I thought Ji Pyeong's growth was interesting as a character apart from Dal Mi, and it was so fun l (AND painful 😅) to watch both male leads grow.
Ji Pyeong grew into someone who knew how to trust others, and show love towards them rather than bottle his feelings up and hide them deep down inside, and Do San learned how to "ride off without a map," finally finding another person he could work side by side with him who cared about following their dreams, too, even when everyone around them said it was stupid to do so.
And both had to learn how to be their true selves; pretty much every character had to learn that integrity and truth-telling is essential to building trust and solid relationships, and the foundation for lasting success of any kind.