Peridot83
Nirvana in Fire Season 2: The Wind Blows in Chang Lin
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The plot of Nirvana in Fire 2 suffered from two main problems 1) Lots of wasted time on an evil exaggerated caricature in the first half (I had to start watching sped up) 2) the characters in the second half show very little character growth.
The acting/cast was uneven as well. I truly enjoyed all the scenes that featured the Xiao family and Lin Xi, and I was super curious about how it would all resolve for them. But, the other characters such as the Emperor, officials/advisors, concubines, I found overacted and boring. I have gone back and watched bits and pieces that I liked.
Music was well done.
I have other criteria I score by:
Complex Themes - 8
(The series does not jump from random plot element to plot element, but actually builds on concepts regarding sacrifices for the greater good, fate vs. individual action, the ups and downs of power, recognising ones limits and the harm of long-held grudges)
Character Growth - 7
(Characters do not change as much as one would hope or think. They will change or grow a bit, but then get 'stuck' either due to limited acting range or limited script)
Nuanced Women - 5
(Like Nirvana in Fire, there are some great nuanced female characters (esp. Meng Qian Xue - the older brother's wife), but unlike Nirvana in Fire there's a lot of simplistic one note female characters as well (esp. in the inner palace).
Cinematography/Production Values - 10
(Beautifully filmed compared to Nirvana in Fire, lots of outdoor scenes, sweeping vistas, huge, choreographed fight scenes).
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A perfect angsty, protective hero romance . . . until the propaganda ruined itOn one hand we have an angsty, forbidden secret childhood romance, and a silent, gruff protective hero who thinks the world of the heroine:everything I like in romance in one place. If you like the Jane Austen novel Persuasion, you will love the first 20 episodes of this.
On the other hand, this is a propaganda pitch for dangerous frontline work to men, and the propaganda wins out for 10 slow dragging episodes.
Our main male character 100% will always pick his job first. The female lead is just so grateful to be in a relationship with him, and she will never make the mistake of putting herself first again! Even his alcoholic waste of a father, and his snobby father in law come around to accepting he is a hero whose needs and priorities come first, and they need to stop making trouble.
So there you have it. A great premise, excellent chemistry and acting all ruined by its simplistic propaganda theme: become a hero of the state, and you'll get the girl and the home and the life you always wanted. Everyone will just be so grateful.
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Short and fast paced limits the typical repeatedness.
Here, a lot of the 'hero' formulas are flipped on their head. On one hand, there are highly toxic ideas of what can make a good person and what can inspire change in a person. On the other hand an important lesson for all: that true, genuine sacrificial love - honoring what the other person needs and not what you desire - will always win.
The acting and chemistry here is decent between the main characters, Dylan Wang is excellent when he is brooding and quite adorably childlike cute whilst in love, the melding of the two personas never really settles in properly. Yu Shu Xin is bubbly and earnest but the plot keeps her smart and with agency - not a fool.
Music is fairly good, not sure I'd rewatch.
Themes: 8.0
True, genuine love where you see each other and respect each other, flaws and all is transformative. With shared values, old rules about who you fight for and who you love go out the window. Ego and the desire to deaden your own humanity may allow you to dominate and win as an individual, but will never be the answer to saving your community. Never forget that there is usually a larger common enemy stirring the pot of discord and divide.
Character Growth: 7.5
Dong Fang Qing Cang jumps around between a cynical, deadened soul and a boy who never grew up - while this is an excellent way to portray him at the beginning, and is justified based on his origin story, the final integration never really satisfyingly takes place. Xiao Lan Hua / Xi Yun is not allowed the same time to integrate and is bubbly and earnest 90% of her screen time.
Complex Women/Interactions Between Women: 7.5
There are plenty of women characters but the desire to pair each of them off with a man leaves them with little meaningful interaction. The friendship of Xiao Lan Hua and Jie Li is the exception, but even that relationship it's unclear what bonds them as friends besides Xiao Lan Hua's open heart and gullibility.
Production Values/Cinematography: 9.0
Compared to the CGI in previous XianXia, this is much more flattering. The sets are well-done and I didn't mind that they replicated Little Orchid's home over and over in order to re-use that set. The color palette, costumes, jewelry and make-up are all very pretty - this is true in all the 'realms'/worlds. Action scenes are very simple, but are pulled off well instead of being complicated and clearly fake.
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First off, these slow, poetic K-dramas are generally not my cup of tea, and this one suffered like the others. After the initial well-done aesthetics, and 'cozy' feel are established nothing ... happens. Plus, the romance was very immature for one woman divorced and one man with an established dating history. If you are familiar with the U.S. show Younger that this is based on, this doesn't have the crazy hijinks and cliffhangers, it is quiet and not much happens.
What kept me watching, was the ideal of work that you love, doing it with integrity, and adding value and well-being in the world. If only we could all work like that! It seems like an ideal from another time, and it moved me a lot. Also, the care the show put in to actually portraying the publishing industry with detail.
Acting was competent, music matched the mood, I absolutely will not be rewatching. I grade on other criteria:
Complex Themes - 7.5
Putting in the time and work to create and bring art into the world is a responsibility and a lifelong passion. Behaving with integrity may cause pain in the short run, but pays off in the long-run. A minor theme on how hard modern capitalism is on mothers.
Character Growth - 4
No one meaningfully changes or grows, they are the same as of episode 2 as the end. Perhaps, the most disappointing part of the show.
Complex women and relationships between women- 7
There's plenty of screen time between the women in the publishing house, them interacting, mentoring, helping and hurting each other. They are all a bit of a stereotype. Dani, it must be said, is a bit of a blank slate - apparently has no friends or family besides what goes on in the publishing house.
Production/Cinematography - 8
I loved all the different outerwear/coats. The clothing and settings really fit the characters. There was a soft, warm feel to the cinematography that suited the show, and I liked how they shot bookstores and books, but it did not attempt to be very creative cinematically.
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In this realistic slow burn romance, Sang Zhi carries the show with her playfulness paired with a fiery stubbornness. She is willing to defer and let Duan Ji Xu lead but only to a point - determined and opinionated she doesn't hesitate to push if necessary. The suspense and tension comes from a few different places - their age difference, Duan Ji Xu's complex family and financial situation. In terms of ethics, their relationship matures with Sang Zhi's age with plenty of time skips. The plot hints at the forbidden without crossing the line.
The plot is simple and it's really the acting and chemistry that sets this apart. You, the audience, can feel and know the longing and hesitation from both sides. As they get older, the awareness that they are physically attracted to each other builds due to excellent acting.
The music is fine, production values bit low. I ended up dropping this before the end as once the central tensions were resolved, I started losing interest.
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Who doesn't love a bad boy/good girl romance? With all the thrills and problems it implies . . . *Discussion of Red Flags at the end*
This modern romance has the life/death feel of a historical drama set in the present day. Li Xun is your black sheep general or heir, highly strategic, intelligent, competent and cold as ice. Zhu Yun is your earnest and bubbly sheltered daughter of a palace adviser who has a hidden righteous fury. Li Xun could conquer the world in one step, if not for his weaknesses which are the family and friends around him especially Zhu Yun. Their journey to happiness takes years of twists and turns, revenge plots and separations.
The beginning creates a lot of suspense by jumping back and forward in time. The end is touching and perfect acknowledging the years that have passed. In the perfect last flip of perspective, Li Xun never says it, but we get to see that Zhu Yun was the best thing that ever happened to him.
Chen Fei Yu as Li Xun excels at a smirky teenage cool. Zhang Jing Yi as Zhu Yun excels at a straight-forward eagerness and stubbornness. They have excellent chemistry together, but limited range. Even as the years pass, you do not get a sense of any time passing for their characters. There's no large moments of self-doubt, no hidden flaws or temperaments that only come out later on. What you see is what you get. Zhao Zhi Wei as Gao does a much better of job of changing into a more bitter, muddle headed adult.
Music is fine, and I wouldn't really rewatch.
I grade on other criteria:
Complex Themes: 9.0
Men who have chips on their shoulder, jealous, unscrupulous and thirsty to succeed can indeed be bad partners. But, these men can come from any economic class. It's wrong to assume that ambitious men who grow up in poorer circumstances will have bad values compared to those from other wealthier backgrounds. Upfront, straight-forward, reliable people of whatever background are worth a dozen schemers.
Complex Characters/Character Growth: 5.5
Gao changes a lot and it’s a very believable change, that he was unable to accept his own limitations, and had unhealthy level of grudges and aggression that grew with time. Li Xun and Zhu Yun stay very consistent throughout.
Complex Women/Complex Relationships Between Women: 7.5
Zhu Yun and her mother have a very complicated and contentious relationship. With her mother unable to see her potential, and so sure that her daughter is the same as her. So, some points there. Otherwise, there are women friendships and characters but they are drawn a bit thin.
Production Value/Cinematography: 5.0
This is filmed very straight on with not too much creativity to clothes or sets let alone camera angles. There’s a camera choice for the very end where it switches to Li Xun that is powerful, but otherwise this category did not stand out to me at all.
*RED FLAGS*
Both Li Xun and Gao display numerous red flags including: smirking in the face of distress, not showing vulnerability, taking away people’s choices, defensiveness, feeling like you are ‘above the rules’ or ‘above the law,’ a lack of friend/familial relationships, uncomfortable feelings, dreams outsized to current reality, quick to sacrifice other people’s feelings to meet your goals etc.
The highly problematic myth of the bad boy/good girl romance is that the love of a good woman can ‘tame’ or soften a bad boy and these traits, and that myth is highly on display here.
What’s worse is that Zhu Yun shows all the signs of someone in the thrall of limerence/obsession running after Li Xun and getting crumbs for 95% of the show. She declares at the end that she knows he will soften/ripen like a peach, but we the viewers see little indication that that’s the case.
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An admirable effort to make the modern case for love and relationships . . .Men - they can be worth it maybe? This series following the Chu parents and their 3 children as they navigate modern love and romance. All 4 relationships are given roughly equivalent screentime. The majority of the episodes are devoted to establishing all the ways relationships in our era go wrong and all the ways we can engage (or not engage) in sex. Just as you are about to despair that all the relationships are trash, the series turns a corner; it's worth watching all the way through.
Note: The cheating, abuse etc. all turn out to be 'misunderstandings.' I though that was a cheap resolution. The abuse storyline, especially should not have been 'don't judge what you don't understand.' Surely the child of an abusive relationship has some insight on to whether or not his father treats his mother appropriately beyond walking in on them one time?
The acting is great to the point where you feel like you are watching a documentary instead of a fictional series. I also thought a lot of the sex scenes were well done. The music was excellent and set the tones/moods of each episode. Cinematically and production wise it was competent with a few sublime moments.
All in all, I'm glad I watched this. It's very different from your normal drama fare, but I wish the payoff was a bit better towards the end.
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*Warning* Part 1 ends in the middle, abruptly. You may want to wait to watch the whole thing together
After a lifetime of betrayal, how should you pick your romantic partners? What does it mean to live a good life and how much are you willing to sacrifice to secure it?
The pitfalls of picking romantic partners here are realistic and addictive, and show the pros and cons of your typical love interests. Each gets a somewhat equal chance, and there isn't an 'obvious winner' as there is in other harem type scenarios. There are four here:
1) The ambitious childhood friend, 2) The kind, soft man inspired by a fierce woman 3) the ruthless and callous lover born out of years of trauma and fighting 4) the golden child, talented and fun with seemingly no darker pasts or sides
Add to that above standard music, and well done investment in cinematography and special effects, and this all came together well. Whether this rises to one of my favorites really depends on how pt 2 shakes out . . .
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A cinematic sports romance full of golden moments . . . This nostalgic (set pre-covid), golden lit romance has a very relaxed, lived in feel. Here is a couple who slowly builds intimacy through jokes, and hugs, and small touches and long looks, until you have a very physical, sensual romance that is believable and in good taste. The forbidden romance elements of the romance, plus the 'against all odds' plot points of the sports create an addictive quality, and the length is perfect at 26 episodes.
*A discussion of red flags and age differences at the end*
Wang An Yu is a believable athlete and can portray a strong range of emotion, Gina Jin does well as a women assistant coach protecting her softer qualities with a matter of fact and gruff outer shell. They both create a very believable relationship together, and they look very comfortable together on screen. The rest of the actors and plots are entertaining but fall far below the main couple.
The music, especially the opening credits, add to the nostalgia - taking place in the pre Covid years, the music and 'vibe' is very peak millennial (in a good way). Golden and sundrenched and wistful. The romantic moments are strong enough to be worth a rewatch.
I grade on other criteria:
Complex Themes: 6.5
Doing well for the people you love can be an excellent motivator for some. Age is just a number. If you are mature and responsible, why not? Taking the long view on career ambitions is not necessarily the best strategy - some options in life (trying to go pro as an athlete) are only available to the young. Many people in places of authority and 'experts' in the field can make the wrong decisions - you should fight for what you deserve.
Character Development: 8.5
Both of them change over the course of the three years of the show, they become more like each other, start to compliment each others strengths and weakness, they grow complexity and it's just really great to watch.
Relationships Between Women/Complex Women: 4.5
The show really falls down on this point especially for 2022. Luo Na has no women friends, none of the directors or coaches are women, and Luo Na does not directly work with any of the women athletes. Luo Na herself is complex a mix of silly and fierce, naive and world wise, but not so complex or unique to makeup for the dearth of other women characters.
Production Values/Cinematography: 9.0
There is a big effort into 1) creating credible sports scenes and 2) playing with angles and light to convey the emotion of falling in love. While clothes, sets, etc. are not particularly noteworthy, the effort put into the cinematography, music 'vibe' of the show, was a wonderful surprise and greatly appreciated.
*RED FLAGS*
Succeeding where so many other shows have failed, the age and power differential provides a bit of forbidden romance but nothing that made me turn it off: the characters meet when they are 18 and 26. Luo Na is in a position of power as an assistant coach who can help Duan Yu Cheng succeed, but she doesn't have the power to cut him from the team or add him to the team. But, Most Importantly, the romantic part of their relationship especially the physical elements do not happen until two years later, and after Duan Yu Cheng has a new head coach and Luo Na is only providing some minimal support. Also Duan Yu Cheng, the younger and the one with less systemic power, is the one pursuing.
HOWEVER, Duan Yu Cheng's characterization occasionally tips over into red flag disturbing. He's constantly calling and texting due to jealousy (26 times in a row), he jumps off a bridge after Luo Na is harsh with him, his emotions jump around wildly, and he's shown that he can lose his head and beat someone far past what is necessary for self defense. He also presurizes Luo Na a fair amount in pursuit of her - exposing things in public that she may not want, such as showy displays of public affection. It wasn't terrible terrible, but it did give me a bit of a pause.
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A beautiful, action filled story of second chances at love and life . . . truly transcends its budgetThis story has a strong point of view as it follows three women from their more rural hometown into the capital city. All have lost, but they come together to remake themselves on the backs of their considerable talent. There's plenty of romance, but the romance does fade to a secondary plot as it wears on. Technically, many plot lines are just dropped, but I enjoyed the plots that remained so much I hardly noticed.
The three 'sisters' are all strong, endearing actors and show some pure brilliance. The male leads are less strong. But, the main couple have a fun compatibility as they slide from dislike, to teasing, to him falling clearly and deeply first. In the second half, however, Chen Xiao's storylines start disappearing, and he literally spends strings of episodes off screen or in a coma and truly becomes a bit of a wooden blockhead.
One piece of ornamental music was very haunting: slowing the pace of the show down so that Zhao Pan Er seems suspended in time. Also, when Song Yinzhang first plays the pippa revenge song, it was so striking and cinematic, that I started looking up pippa music, and that music was such a well-done turning point for the character.
A few scenes really stand out to rewatch: there's these moments where the joy of being alive, even in very difficult times shines through, and in the end I was really sorry to leave this universe behind.
I grade on other criteria:
Complex Themes: 10
We all deserve second chances and the chance to thrive throughout our lives- women just as much as anyone else. Living a life without regret, requires staring reality in the face. Suffering comes from an inability to accept and adapt to reality. Bad luck can strike more than once in a lifetime. Found families can provide comfort where biological families are gone or lacking. Always prepare for the worst and be careful of those who makes easy promises.
Character Growth/Complex Characters: 8.5
Song Yinzhang displays the most character growth going from someone who is timid and looking for a rescuer, to standing firmly on her own two feet. Zhao Pan Er more gains complexity with time then truly transforms, and credit to the writers all of the top 10 featured characters to do grow quite a bit. A point off for a cartoonish villain and the half baked court adviser villains.
Complex Female Characters/Relationships:9.5
It's a true joy to see fully fleshed out women in their complexity pursuing ambition and friendship and the good life together. It was perhaps a tad too idyllic, but I didn't mind.
Cinematography/Production Values: 8.5
Really punches above its weight. There was very beautiful cinematic work in scenes that really stick with you changes in pacing and lighting and moving from wide angles to close ups. More creative than shows with double the budget.
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The story/plot here is daytime soap level bad. Love triangles, coincidences, misunderstandings and missed connections, plus unnecessary violence and self-sabotaging behavior (very non sexy though for otherwise having such bad b-movie plotting!)
I wouldn't, however, IMHO say it was particularly red flag worthy or triggering anymore than any other drama. You have your classical deception followed by regret plot (see cyrano de bergerac or taming of the shrew). Violence breaks out in two fights where the less powerful character explodes at what he sees as bullying by powerful people.
Plus, Nam Do -San genuinely finds Seo Dal-mi inspiring and respects that she has many of the qualities he lacks. He doesn't put his fantasy of who she is on a pedestal only to debase her when she turns out to be a real woman. When he finally apologises for the deception, he doesn't try to minimize what he did or make light of it.
The actors here are good, and while there is a lot of crying, I am all for normalizing men crying! I also liked that both romantic male leads genuinely were cheering on the female lead professionally. Also, that the women bond over career and interests and family more than they do about men. I liked the at ease puppy love of the younger couple and the suspense of whether that could mature into something lasting.
The music kept with the modern, pops of color of the show. There is nothing here to rewatch.
I grade on other criteria as well:
Complex Themes: 6.5
Family is who shows up not just who provides blood or money. The show had an excellent theme going about pure hearted enthusiasm of youth v a jaded cynicism of older age, but transitioned it to a lack lustre theme instead of sell-out for a few years, and you too can be a commercial success! All the weird insistence that they were doing something inspiring and changing the world with a self-driving car start-up was a bit bizarre.
Character Growth: 7.5
The older sister ends up having the most interesting career trajectory. I truly enjoyed her slow transition and switch from living her adopted father's values to her own. The others don't have so much growth as time brings experience, money and power behind them.
Complex women/relationships between women: 8.5
This was truly one of the genuinely great aspects of the show. The older sister has no love interest! There's an older female investor mentor. Multiple women are genuinely interested and passionate about career growth. There is a great subplot between the grandmother and her daughter in law, and the older women have a lot of scenes and character development that you usually don't see.
Production values/cinematography: 8
I really feel like this team got let down by the script and director. Every single time the show could have had a sublime moment, it would instead go with the worst possible literal take ever. As a result, it's very prettily filmed, wealthy characters feel decently wealthy etc., but you rarely got that eerie, transported feeling.
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Moon Embracing the Sun suffers from being pre- golden age of big budget, creative concept era K dramas.
Plot points are endlessly repeated, pacing is slow to allow for viewers skipping/missing episodes. Each character has their predictable role to play: the endlessly self-sacrificing female lead, the righteous, angst filled male lead, the long-suffering mother etc. Very little is explored or developed despite being longer than most K dramas today. It's an addictive show as the female lead is often in need of rescuing, and there's lots of romantic suspense. But, once you realize that there will be no twist, no resetting of expectations it starts to drag.
Acting is all over the map. Some of the child actors are brilliant (and at this point we know on their way to successful adult acting careers), some are over-acting and stilted. Same when everything switches to adults. The two main adult leads have little chemistry together but both are very good at playing their roles independently (especially angst filled/sad moments).
Music is fine. Would not rewatch.
I grade on other criteria:
Complex Themes: 7
Beware of karma it comes for everyone. Attempting to protect relatives from the consequences of their own actions/greed, just allows them to continue to damage others. Keeping secrets is unfair to those hurt by them. Don't force a romantic relationship if it doesn't feel right.
Character Development/Growth: 5
The king's sister matures a bit, but the show almost makes a point of how people stay the same over the years.
Complex women characters/relationships: 4
There's lots of women roles, but everyone is a stereotype/caricature. The one exception is actually the head shaman.There's some interesting ideas about how to sort out competing priorities and values, and sisterhood. The shaman is an interesting, complicated character.
Production budget/cinematography: 4
The costuming for the men is not flattering, materials looks shiny and cheap and are in strange color combinations. The sets are very claustrophobic and repeat all the time. This was shot with HD Cameras full on, and clear in a way that isn't particularly flattering.
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The main action centers around work-place strategy and political intrigue. These plots move fast with lots of suspenseful tension. I was 100% addicted. It's very dramatic while still keeping a touch of realism.
The secondary action is around relationships. The main romance does drag on with 'will they' or 'won't they?', HOWEVER, I loved seeing a fully realized romantic relationship on screen (instead of just tension, tension, tension - kiss! over). They also have a more at ease, physical relationship than in many K-dramas.
The music was the best I'd ever heard in a K-drama set in the present day.
I'm not sure I'd re-watch, since it's set up as a mystery/suspense.
I grade on other criteria ...
Complex Themes - 7
There actually isn't much there, there. Some themes around karma, treating people as how you will want to be treated. How to deal with cruelty, corruption and power through concrete action.
Character Growth - 7.5
The characters are fairly fixed. The one BIG exception : Song Ga Kyung (Jeon Hye Jin). She goes from being weak, petty and cruel to rediscovering an inner strength that was inspirational to watch.
Complex Women/Female Relationships - 10
The show centers around female protagonists AND female antagonists. The men have a secondary role . Not only are women front and center, but they have very complex feelings and relationships with each other. It was incredibly refreshing.
Cinematography/Production Values - 10
Lots of creative cinematic camera angles, lighting, and staging. The clothes and sets are great, realistic with a touch of fantasy. There is a ton of product placement, but that also allowed for the wealthy characters to look and act believably wealthy.
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What if the gender roles were reversed in a Cinderella romance? Could the relationship survive or would the man feel too emasculated? Could he find a way to be a man while being the less powerful, less wealthy half?
The initial premise becomes weighed down with large scale conspiracies, sickly sweet morals about the 'common people,' and lots of sickness/death wish fulfilment. Ultimately, the show is completely unrealistic, full on daytime soap level drama, but with extremely slow pacing.
The two actors have little chemistry, the music is just OK, and besides one scene early on where our male lead rescues the female lead, there's nothing here I would rewatch.
This is one of the most popular KDramas, with prestige actors, and so I've been trying to suffer through but I can't anymore . . . I'm dropping.
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Of the fantasy/xianxia shows I've watched this one is the most adult/serious. It's not necessarily the one with the best growth and themes (that goes to Ashes of Love). But this focuses mostly on adults with adult issues (marriage, raising children, feuding families, honouring ones mentor etc.)
I enjoyed watching it, it was addicting and I was curious how it would resolve. But, I don't have the same fondness for the couple as I do for some of the other shows I've watched.
The plot was very engaging and rarely too repetitive, and the actors on their own were quite good. But, when the couple was on screen together, you didn't get the little looks/touches energy of a couple in love. In the end, I was happy with the story and glad I watched it all the way through, but I wasn't sad to leave the universe behind.... EXCEPT
I really enjoyed the secondary couple between Bai Fengjiu and Dong Hua, and I'm glad to see they are getting their own spinoff. It never felt like wasted time, and they actually seemed to have a more give and take, naturalistic type interactions than the main couple.
Music was nothing special, and I'm not sure whether I'd watch it again, perhaps certain scenes.
Other Criteria I score by
Complex Themes - 6
(Ye Hua and Bai Qian go through a lot over their lifetimes, but there are not strong themes besides appreciating the love that you have, and being loyal/having honour). Also, giving in to overbearing parents is endless, one needs to find the moral strength to stand up to them.)
Character Growth -7
(Both Ye Hua and Bai Qian show a decent amount of character growth, as they go through romance and lots of loss)
Nuanced Women -7
(Bai Qian and Bai Fengjiu both have nuanced personalities, and are good playing different types Bai Qian is more tom boyish and then stoic/austere, whereas Bai Fengjiu is more silly and headstrong)
Cinematography/Production Values - 6
(It's all CGI and green screens unless they are in the human world, I didn't find the worlds created or the costumes very beautiful, but it was all competently done)
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