RoyalM

Well, that's really patronizing. People can have different takes from the same thing. In fact, that's what makes debating interesting. But you saying that makes me think that you are not interested in a healthy debate with different points of view, you just want to validate your opinion.

That's interesting. Can you elaborate?

I don't think that Ming made Joe die, Joe is an adult and he knew the whole movie thing was shady. Ming contributed, of course, but Joe is also to blame here. I think we are seeing Joe from differents point of view. I don't see him as weak, on the contrary, it takes a lot of courage to say "This is what I want and I'm going to go for it". He is fighting for his happiness, giving it one more shot.

I will talk as someone who likes Joe and Ming ending togueter. In real life, I wouldn't touch someone as Ming even with a pole, BUT we are watching a piece of fiction. I'm tired of basic BLs plots and I love this mature take in all the characters. Other mistake, in my opinion, is underestimating Joe. Ming showed him is red flags and Joe fell for him anyway, even now the thing that hurt him the must is Ming not loving him. I think that Joe loves him and Ming loves him back. BUT I repeat, it makes sense to me in this fiction we are watching, it's not a reflection of what I would think if it was real life. I don't apologize anything that Ming did, but I still like him as a character (even when I scream "Ming, I hate you!" in almost every episode)

I'm with you right there. It's fiction. 🤷🏾‍♀️

Thank you!!!

I never said Joe was a masochist. What I don't think is that he is blinded by love, he knows who Ming is. Not everyone likes a nice perfect guy, some people are atracted to strong controlling personalities and that doesn't made them masochists. The worst thing Ming did was kidnapping him, that's literally a crime, but Joe sees it as" You love Tong so much that you did that to me". I accept their relationship for what it is, not for what I would like to myself of what I think is the best thing.

Totally! Their relationship isn't black and white, is full of grey.

In ep 9, Joe let it all out, he told Ming all the things he wanted to say. He never said anything about the way Ming treated him, what really hurt him was Ming not loving him back. I'm not saying he is into being abused, but he is into bastard cold Ming. And why do I say that? Because Ming never pretended to be someone else and Joe still fell for him.

I'm not supporting Ming, I never say that, he is a psycho. Some people ask for mature BL and then can't handle complex characters. 🤷🏾‍♀️

The big problem is that Joe is into that, some people like toxic relationships. He is making an adult decision, he knows who Ming is, he is not being gaslighted.

What I don't understand is why people want Ming to be a whole different person. I personally like the maturity of Ming and Joe relationship. Ming is toxic AF, but he never gaslighted Joe. Joe knew who he was from the start and he made the mature decision of loving him anyway. In fact, Joe let all his anger out in this episode, and he never acused Ming of the things people hate him more for.

Sol's puppy love was not what Joe wanted. And Joe's love was not what Ming wanted, but was what he needed. They complete each other perfectly.

Exactly! The whole episode was Joe telling Ming "You never loved me". That was his only problem.

🤣

Exactly! I'm so glad that I'm not the only one thinking like that. People are analyzing Joe from their point of view and not from the nature of the character.

That's what I've been saying the whole time! Joe knew from the start that Ming was a red flag. His only problem is that he thinks that Ming doesn't love him. That's what broke his heart.

At some point I secreamed "Ming, I hate you!" 🤣

Totally. It's like "Why are you even here?" 🙄

I hate him in this episode.