It's hard to explain without additional context. So allow me to ask, what are the things that made Young Woo appear…
> First of all, thank you for taking the time to reply and be willing to explain. I'm glad my post wasn't taken as a hate comment, as i really wasn't hating on the show.
No worries. You asked a question.
> Also if you could take the time to correct me if I should refer to FL as autistic or has autism/autism spectrum disorder, I would greatly appreciate it.
A very good one! Within the autistic community (meaning, actually autistics), the preferred terminology is identity-first which is "autistic". "Autistic" sends the meaning that autism is an integral and inseparable part of an autistic person's whole being. Compare that to "with autism", it sends the message that autism can be cured, or removed, like some form of disease or a virus; or it is like "a person with a bag" that they can drop anytime and they are just "a person".
Even government organizations, NPO (non-profit), NGO (non-government), and other private support organizations, switched to identity-first "autistic". Many parents of autistic children also agreed.
Personally, I do not care if one refers to me as "with autism" as long as there is no negative context applied to it. I do prefer "autistic" but I am not going to force them to use it. But that is just me, I can't speak for others.
There is also sentence construction, and let's face it, only a small part of the world's population are English speakers. English is an official language here in the Philippines other than our own Filipino language. It is an integral part in our education. But even me I'm struggling finding the right way to explain things. So, I don't shy away with using "in the autism spectrum" or "has autism".
If I am writing an article, say in my own blog, I'll be extra mindful of it. But in forums like this one in MDL, I'm not strict with myself.
> To me, the childish side of the FL stood out the most with the revolving doors and her dancing to go through them, and the ML finding that cute/funny and even being the one to suggest she dances in their work building.
Ahh, good one. I was thinking of that but I was not sure if my guess is correct.
* There are autistics who do find revolving doors confusing (or challenging). There are so many things involved in it that some autistics can not pick up the timing correctly. For example, there might be other people with you as you enter a revolving door. An autistic may find it very uncomfortable. There are also autistics with hyper sensitivity with smells, and the air inside revolving doors usually gets stuck there for a few revolutions. This may cause sensory overload and even a meltdown.
I for one, even as an adult, I still avoid revolving doors if possible. There were times when the side doors are locked and the only option was to use the revolving doors that I just find another exit. Sometimes I'm fine with using it.
* Young Woo dancing through it is her method of trying to find order or timing. It is also for calming herself down. Unfortunately, Young Woo can not find her timing, and if she does, she loses focus of the exit so she ends up inside again.
> Or her bringing up whales, which are her passion, and the ML seemingly only listening to them so she has someone to talk to and not because he is actually interested. Notice how he never asks any questions about what she says about whales. To me, it felt like what adults do with kids when a kid wants to show their knowledge on a topic but the adults don't actually care about said topic.
Ahh, great eye! Yes, Joon Ho's reaction is very, very, common among non-autistics whenever talking to an autistic. The only difference in this scenario is that Joon Ho is already aware Young Woo is autistic. If he was not aware she's autistic, he'll probably start showing boredom or irritation, or attempt to cut her (probably with annoyance in his voice too -- which an autistic will probably not pick up).
In real life, this was the general observation between a non-autistic who is aware the person they're talking to is autistic versus one who is not aware. What you observed is actually true to life. So yeah, you are correct, Joon Ho was treating her like a kid and it is probably sending the wrong message to Young Woo.
> To me, how he over-simplifies how he speaks to her comes off more as him treating her like a child than as being direct/clear.
Ahh. This one is fine. Autistics, like me, highly prefer simple words that can not be taken any other way. Almost all autistics are not good with sarcasm, reading between the lines, idiomatic expressions, and all that stuff. We have to learn these things, it is not natural for us. So the simpler the words are, the better.
It may appear rude because it looks like a person is patronizing (did I use this word correctly?) the autistic person, but from an autisic person's perspective, "thank you very much, I can understand you". ^_^
> This last point can seem controversial, but her lack of social queues and awareness do resemble that of a child. I'm aware ASD makes these things hard and is a struggle, though I am not sure to what degree.
Hmm… the thing with an autistic mind is that we process things differently, and social awareness and social cues just aren't part of this different way of thinking and processing inputs. Social awareness for example is more about understanding another person's emotions. Many of us are not good with it, and this is the reason why there is a myth that autistics do not have empathy. We do have empathy, however, we process and express it far differently from the way non-autistics understand and express "empathy".
This lack of social awareness and understanding social cues is inherent in being autistic. Yes, even us autistic adults. We have to learn these things, it is not natural or automatic for us.
In Young Woo's case, at least based on what the show has established, it was the first time for her to actually be "in the world". Prior to that, she was mostly protected by her father, and in school, she stayed away from her classmates because they were bullying her. The result, less interaction with "the world". And well, her classmates probably did not want to have anything to do with her beacuse they can not understand her.
Since we need to learn social cues, her lack of interaction placed her in a situation wherein as an autistic adult, she still has to learn these. So yep, that's why it resemble that of a child, as far as social things are concerned, she was lacking in that area.
As for the "degree" that differs per person. Then there is also age and experience to consider. In Young Woo's case, her autistic traits and quirks are more profound, so people around her notices it. There are also many autistics that are not easy to spot (even fellow autistics wouldn't notice) because they've learned how to mask very well. Could have Young Woo learned how to mask? Yeah, if she had more interaction with her classmates, she probably would've learned it and make it less obvious. One way of masking is copying other people.
As you progress with the series, try to notice how Young Woo had her little pauses, and appear to be thinking, and then will say something (not case related). It is her checking her internal list of "dos and donts in interacting with people and what to say". I can't remember a good scene right now but say I am talking and I mentioned a relative who passed away, then someone said, "I'm sorry", it literally distracts me. My mind is trying to process what I heard, "Why? Did you kill my relative that's why you are sorry?" You will see Young Woo processing, thinking, asking, similar questions in the other episodes.
Or, do it in reverse. An autistic heard someone say their relative died (and it happened ages ago too), social expectation is to say, "I'm sorry". For an autistic, if this is not in their internal "dos and donts in social interaction", they wouldn't say it. Like in my case, since it is already in my internal checklist, I will say it even if I don't understand why. Does it mean it is meaningless? In that instance, I would say yes, because saying "I'm sorry" is not our way of sympathizing. For me personally, staying solemn is me sympathizing.
^_^
> My discomfort is how he finds it cute or attractive.
I'd say it's good because you are seeing the problem and how it may affect their relationship. I'm not sure how far you've watched, so I'll leave it at that, it might be a spoiler. ;)
I'm not up to date with the drama yet, But the romance between the FL and ML seems extremely childish?To the point…
It's hard to explain without additional context. So allow me to ask, what are the things that made Young Woo appear as "extremely childish", "innocent", and "naive like a kid"?
As an autistic person myself, I can explain it to you. Not perfectly, but I can give you an autistic insight into it. However, I need to know what are the things that made her look that way from your perspective.
It has to be specific because from my vantage point, since I understand her character, being autistic myself, she doesn't appear to me the way she does to you. I have to understand the traits and quirks you noticed.
You can give examples of scenes, explain it a little, and why or how it appears childish, innocent, naive for you. Then I'll explain each.
Today's data breach trial was by far one of my favorites. I wished Jun Ho would have gone and held WYW for comfort…
> I wished Jun Ho would have gone and held WYW for comfort during the poison scene.
Yeah. For a non-autistic, he is too literal with how he's handling their break-up.
It shows that he still doesn't understand her fully, and he's struggling with it. Which is good because he can use this experience to decide for himself if pursuing a relationship with an autistic woman is something he can truly live for the rest of his life … assuming of course his goal is marriage.
More often than not, a break up is needed to force us to see things objectively. When we are in love, autistic or non-autistic, we often get swept up by the little things. Emotions, kindness, the person's presence, and so on, that we fail to see the other important things. Unfortunately, when couples get married, that's when those things start to show up and well … if they can't face it properly, the marriage gets broken even if they don't get a divorce.
Can you recommend me any daily drama with cute romance like this? I've seen once again, Father is strange,
Hmm, like this one with cute romance, not much on my plate unfortunately.
Though I can recommend these: - "You're the Best" can qualify as a family drama - "Our Blues" (life drama) - "Be My Dream Family", a family drama - "First Love Again" (C-drama, experiencing your first love again) - "While You Were Sleeping"
I'm sorry that we autistics are frustrating. Trust me, people who think they are "normal" are equally frustrating…
I'm not being "defensive and aggressive", it just is the truth. I'm simply giving you the perspective on our side.
Surely, since you gave your perspective we can also give ours, right? Or, is it one way?
^_^
PS If I was being "defensive and aggressive" as you said I am, then I wouldn't have ended it with this emoticon: ^_^
I just meant it as it is, literally. No need to read between the lines or add an emotion or two. It just is. If that's how it appeared to you, then I apologise, I am sorry. That was not what I meant nor my intention.
Sad, but I may give up comments section in MDL altogether.There is an increasing disconnect between real world…
Yep. It's the same in other previous shows. But when you look at other communities, people understand just fine.
Also there's a growing number of recently created accounts, or accounts created before but were not used, that started to leave nasty comments here in EAW and other shows.
And yet, MDL is doing nothing at all. They won't even take action if you report these accounts.
They also have a limit on the number of accounts you can block. Like seriously. They want to expose you to these accounts.
1 
No worries. You asked a question.
> Also if you could take the time to correct me if I should refer to FL as autistic or has autism/autism spectrum disorder, I would greatly appreciate it.
A very good one! Within the autistic community (meaning, actually autistics), the preferred terminology is identity-first which is "autistic". "Autistic" sends the meaning that autism is an integral and inseparable part of an autistic person's whole being. Compare that to "with autism", it sends the message that autism can be cured, or removed, like some form of disease or a virus; or it is like "a person with a bag" that they can drop anytime and they are just "a person".
Even government organizations, NPO (non-profit), NGO (non-government), and other private support organizations, switched to identity-first "autistic". Many parents of autistic children also agreed.
Personally, I do not care if one refers to me as "with autism" as long as there is no negative context applied to it. I do prefer "autistic" but I am not going to force them to use it. But that is just me, I can't speak for others.
There is also sentence construction, and let's face it, only a small part of the world's population are English speakers. English is an official language here in the Philippines other than our own Filipino language. It is an integral part in our education. But even me I'm struggling finding the right way to explain things. So, I don't shy away with using "in the autism spectrum" or "has autism".
If I am writing an article, say in my own blog, I'll be extra mindful of it. But in forums like this one in MDL, I'm not strict with myself.
> To me, the childish side of the FL stood out the most with the revolving doors and her dancing to go through them, and the ML finding that cute/funny and even being the one to suggest she dances in their work building.
Ahh, good one. I was thinking of that but I was not sure if my guess is correct.
* There are autistics who do find revolving doors confusing (or challenging). There are so many things involved in it that some autistics can not pick up the timing correctly. For example, there might be other people with you as you enter a revolving door. An autistic may find it very uncomfortable. There are also autistics with hyper sensitivity with smells, and the air inside revolving doors usually gets stuck there for a few revolutions. This may cause sensory overload and even a meltdown.
I for one, even as an adult, I still avoid revolving doors if possible. There were times when the side doors are locked and the only option was to use the revolving doors that I just find another exit. Sometimes I'm fine with using it.
* Young Woo dancing through it is her method of trying to find order or timing. It is also for calming herself down. Unfortunately, Young Woo can not find her timing, and if she does, she loses focus of the exit so she ends up inside again.
> Or her bringing up whales, which are her passion, and the ML seemingly only listening to them so she has someone to talk to and not because he is actually interested. Notice how he never asks any questions about what she says about whales. To me, it felt like what adults do with kids when a kid wants to show their knowledge on a topic but the adults don't actually care about said topic.
Ahh, great eye! Yes, Joon Ho's reaction is very, very, common among non-autistics whenever talking to an autistic. The only difference in this scenario is that Joon Ho is already aware Young Woo is autistic. If he was not aware she's autistic, he'll probably start showing boredom or irritation, or attempt to cut her (probably with annoyance in his voice too -- which an autistic will probably not pick up).
In real life, this was the general observation between a non-autistic who is aware the person they're talking to is autistic versus one who is not aware. What you observed is actually true to life. So yeah, you are correct, Joon Ho was treating her like a kid and it is probably sending the wrong message to Young Woo.
> To me, how he over-simplifies how he speaks to her comes off more as him treating her like a child than as being direct/clear.
Ahh. This one is fine. Autistics, like me, highly prefer simple words that can not be taken any other way. Almost all autistics are not good with sarcasm, reading between the lines, idiomatic expressions, and all that stuff. We have to learn these things, it is not natural for us. So the simpler the words are, the better.
It may appear rude because it looks like a person is patronizing (did I use this word correctly?) the autistic person, but from an autisic person's perspective, "thank you very much, I can understand you". ^_^
> This last point can seem controversial, but her lack of social queues and awareness do resemble that of a child. I'm aware ASD makes these things hard and is a struggle, though I am not sure to what degree.
Hmm… the thing with an autistic mind is that we process things differently, and social awareness and social cues just aren't part of this different way of thinking and processing inputs. Social awareness for example is more about understanding another person's emotions. Many of us are not good with it, and this is the reason why there is a myth that autistics do not have empathy. We do have empathy, however, we process and express it far differently from the way non-autistics understand and express "empathy".
This lack of social awareness and understanding social cues is inherent in being autistic. Yes, even us autistic adults. We have to learn these things, it is not natural or automatic for us.
In Young Woo's case, at least based on what the show has established, it was the first time for her to actually be "in the world". Prior to that, she was mostly protected by her father, and in school, she stayed away from her classmates because they were bullying her. The result, less interaction with "the world". And well, her classmates probably did not want to have anything to do with her beacuse they can not understand her.
Since we need to learn social cues, her lack of interaction placed her in a situation wherein as an autistic adult, she still has to learn these. So yep, that's why it resemble that of a child, as far as social things are concerned, she was lacking in that area.
As for the "degree" that differs per person. Then there is also age and experience to consider. In Young Woo's case, her autistic traits and quirks are more profound, so people around her notices it. There are also many autistics that are not easy to spot (even fellow autistics wouldn't notice) because they've learned how to mask very well. Could have Young Woo learned how to mask? Yeah, if she had more interaction with her classmates, she probably would've learned it and make it less obvious. One way of masking is copying other people.
As you progress with the series, try to notice how Young Woo had her little pauses, and appear to be thinking, and then will say something (not case related). It is her checking her internal list of "dos and donts in interacting with people and what to say". I can't remember a good scene right now but say I am talking and I mentioned a relative who passed away, then someone said, "I'm sorry", it literally distracts me. My mind is trying to process what I heard, "Why? Did you kill my relative that's why you are sorry?" You will see Young Woo processing, thinking, asking, similar questions in the other episodes.
Or, do it in reverse. An autistic heard someone say their relative died (and it happened ages ago too), social expectation is to say, "I'm sorry". For an autistic, if this is not in their internal "dos and donts in social interaction", they wouldn't say it. Like in my case, since it is already in my internal checklist, I will say it even if I don't understand why. Does it mean it is meaningless? In that instance, I would say yes, because saying "I'm sorry" is not our way of sympathizing. For me personally, staying solemn is me sympathizing.
^_^
> My discomfort is how he finds it cute or attractive.
I'd say it's good because you are seeing the problem and how it may affect their relationship. I'm not sure how far you've watched, so I'll leave it at that, it might be a spoiler. ;)
Someone actually noticed it. Hahaha. I was just having fun with it.
As an autistic person myself, I can explain it to you. Not perfectly, but I can give you an autistic insight into it. However, I need to know what are the things that made her look that way from your perspective.
It has to be specific because from my vantage point, since I understand her character, being autistic myself, she doesn't appear to me the way she does to you. I have to understand the traits and quirks you noticed.
You can give examples of scenes, explain it a little, and why or how it appears childish, innocent, naive for you. Then I'll explain each.
^_^
What I do is:
1. Type in my comment and post/send it
2. Refresh
3. Copy the comment number
4. Edit my last post
^_^
So for example, this comment is #10902 (after refresh)
Yeah. For a non-autistic, he is too literal with how he's handling their break-up.
It shows that he still doesn't understand her fully, and he's struggling with it. Which is good because he can use this experience to decide for himself if pursuing a relationship with an autistic woman is something he can truly live for the rest of his life … assuming of course his goal is marriage.
More often than not, a break up is needed to force us to see things objectively. When we are in love, autistic or non-autistic, we often get swept up by the little things. Emotions, kindness, the person's presence, and so on, that we fail to see the other important things. Unfortunately, when couples get married, that's when those things start to show up and well … if they can't face it properly, the marriage gets broken even if they don't get a divorce.
https://mydramalist.com/discussions/strange-lawyer-woo-young-woo/78371-episode-15-feedback-from-an-autistic-relationship-commentary
Comment #10880
Though I can recommend these:
- "You're the Best" can qualify as a family drama
- "Our Blues" (life drama)
- "Be My Dream Family", a family drama
- "First Love Again" (C-drama, experiencing your first love again)
- "While You Were Sleeping"
There is also the possibility he'll be discharged earlier.
[ Comment #10327 ]
https://mydramalist.com/photos/26Yx2_3
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Fanmade by Anj Alfieri from HallyuStyle Philippines.
Then based on it, I created a Spotify playlist: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/1uwie81wpBxAjChRtGX404?si=41414bc2f8194142
Surely, since you gave your perspective we can also give ours, right? Or, is it one way?
^_^
PS
If I was being "defensive and aggressive" as you said I am, then I wouldn't have ended it with this emoticon: ^_^
I just meant it as it is, literally. No need to read between the lines or add an emotion or two. It just is. If that's how it appeared to you, then I apologise, I am sorry. That was not what I meant nor my intention.
Also there's a growing number of recently created accounts, or accounts created before but were not used, that started to leave nasty comments here in EAW and other shows.
And yet, MDL is doing nothing at all. They won't even take action if you report these accounts.
They also have a limit on the number of accounts you can block. Like seriously. They want to expose you to these accounts.
Same reaction as you, I wanted to punch that person's face. =))