Fan Fiction Thread for Lost You Forever

 liddi:

The lyrics has a hint of bleakness and despair in it

That seems fitting. The drama has a lot of suffering. 

 liddi:

though I am at a loss to understand what the English lyrics are meant to convey  "Die bored, Not Mine."

Lol, you and me both.

 liddi:

I am enjoying the C-adaptation a lot thus far. I never read the books previously, so I am in a novel situation where I am reading the book alongside the drama viewing. Have not gotten very far yet  (11 chapters, 3 episodes) but very keen to continue. I read great reviews about the C-adaptation, and not so complimentary ones about the Netflix version. What little I know of the Netflix synopsis indicates a focus that diverges from the source material, and having several characters representing an aspect of the original character, among other things. Still, I do intend to check out the Netflix version, but only after I have finished the C-version and the novel.

 nathsketch:

Go for the Cdrama. The Neftlix drama is very underwhelming, and, except for the veteran actors like Jonathan Pryce, Liam Cunningham, and  Benedict Wong, for example, the acting is not the best. They changed a lot from the cdrama and the novel. I couldn't relate to any of the characters, most of them were extremely annoying and/or useless.

Also, D.B. Weiss and David Benioff. I said wouldn't ever trust them again after Game of Thrones, so my expectations were already low.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, both of you. ^^ 

I'm more inclined to try the C-drama. But she feels that only an adaptation produced outside of mainland China would faithfully adapt what happened to Ye Wenjie's father. We had family in China in '89 in the aftermath of Tiananmen Square and family that took in refuges who were blacklisted. So she's interested to see that part of the story without censorship interference. I did mention the GoT writers to her!

 liddi:

Have you read the novel before?

I haven't. The plot / premise doesn't totally appeal to me, but if I watch a drama version and find it interesting I might check out the book too. I've heard that it's very well written and the translation is also really well done, with exactly the kind of explanatory footnotes I like. Although with so many versions and adaptations, it feels a little dangerous. So much content to potentially obsess over. 

 liddi:

Before this, I always assumed that it was the discovery of the crystal globe within the big-bellied doll, the latter of which had also absorbed his power and blood, that led to the vision, because a tangible part of him still existed within the doll itself.

Ooh I like that explanation too! Especially since the dream was specifically about the ice crystal ball and the big-bellied laughing doll's creation. 

 liddi:

With that reunion, do you imagine them to still exist together in the manifestation of the sea shell? Or would their souls finally found rest upon their reunion, this time, together?

Tong Hua didn't describe what happened to Ah Heng and Chi You's souls after they disappeared from XY's sight and I kind of like that she left the next step open to interpretation, apart from the fact that, whatever it involved, it was something that they faced together. 

I think part of the reason I like the open ended-ness is that I want them (both Ah Heng and Chi You as a pair and XY and XL as a pair) to have their chance to be together, but the idea of an eternal afterlife... it's not a thought that appeals to me. 

This is making me think of a novel. I won't say which one since this is rather spoilery, but in that novel's universe the souls of the dead cross a body of water, travel through the land of the dead / underworld, and then (if they choose) walk through a door between worlds into a very pleasant, natural and peaceful world, but (because that world is beyond the land of the dead) a mere gentle breeze will cause the essence of the dead person's soul to drift apart into millions of disconnected atoms that will no longer be tied to a conscious self and that instead each become part of the grass, the soil, the trees, the flowers, etc. 

“....When you go out of here, all the particles that make you up will loosen and float apart... All the atoms that were them, they’ve gone into the air and the wind and the trees and the earth and all the living things. They’ll never vanish. They’re just part of everything... part of everything alive again.”

"Even if it means oblivion, friends, I’ll welcome it, because it won’t be nothing. We’ll be alive again in a thousand blades of grass, and a million leaves; we’ll be falling in the raindrops and blowing in the fresh breeze; we’ll be glistening in the dew under the stars and the moon out there in the physical world."

I've seen the concept compared to Mary Elizabeth Frye's poem 'Do Not Stand at My Grave and Weep':

Do not stand at my grave and weep
I am not there; I do not sleep.
I am a thousand winds that blow,
I am the diamond glints on snow,
I am the sun on ripened grain,
I am the gentle autumn rain.
When you awaken in the morning’s hush
I am the swift uplifting rush
Of quiet birds in circled flight.
I am the soft stars that shine at night.
Do not stand at my grave and cry,
I am not there; I did not die.

In the novel I mentioned, there is a couple who love each other, but who are doomed to live in separate worlds, never getting to see each other again for the rest of their lives. 

Before they part, one of those characters says to the other: "I will love you forever; whatever happens. Till I die and after I die, and when I find my way out of the land of the dead, I'll drift about forever, all my atoms, till I find you again..."

And the other character responds: "I'll be looking for you, [character name], every moment, every single moment. And when we do find each other again, we'll cling together so tight that nothing and no one'll ever tear us apart. Every atom of me and every atom of you...We'll live in birds and flowers and dragonflies and pine trees and in clouds and in those little specks of light you see floating in sunbeams...And when they use our atoms to make new lives, they won't just be able to take one, they'll have to take two, one of you and one of me, we'll be joined so tight..."

If XL and XY's souls went on one final journey together that ended with the particles that made up each of their souls being scattered across nature, but with parts of each of their souls joined together for eternity, I'd be satisfied with that.

Chapter 5: The Northern Tavern

The Northern Tavern was run by Lao Ping, his daughter, and son-in-law, descendants of an unnamed Shennong remnant who had died in battle with Master Xiang Liu. Lao Ping was a low level deity, but somehow had managed to live a longer life than he had expected. He was hunched a bit with white gray hairs and talked with a rasp. His daughter and son in law were ordinary and common in every way. His ancestors made it a family tradition to name their eldest son Ping, as an ironic reminder that peace cost their patriarch’s life. Impoverished, the patriarch left his wife and son to join the remnant army for whatever little scrap he could get. Before his death, with the rations during those years, he managed to help his wife buy a small rolling noodle stall that was passed down generations to keep everyone from starving. Lao Ping had only a daughter and was too poor to provide a dowry to marry her off, so a young man who was even poorer married into the family by taking the traditional name of Ping.

Maoqiu encountered him one fateful day as he was personally delivering a pair of delicate silver hairpins to Tu Shan Zhen's new bride. Maoqiu doesn't remember why, but he had an urge to eat a bowl of noodles, and just so happened to see Lao Ping’s stall. While eating and pondering how he had lost count of how many women Tu Shan Zhen had taken in, the guards from the inn across the street asked the old man to move the stall. The old man begged them to let him finish his business for the day. He promised he would find a new spot the next day, but the guards continued to harass him and eventually destroyed his entire stock. Maoqiu was only able to slightly help prevent injury to the old man in order to continue to keep his own identity hidden.

As he helped the old man move his stall, along the way, he learned of his past. Maoqiu listened attentively, only giving the old man sounds of affirmation and understanding. Maoqiu remembered that when he started to earn money from his jewelry, at first, he didn't know what to do with it. For centuries, Maoqiu had made a habit of just giving it away to beggars, orphans, and widows as he came by, especially those with ties to the Shennong remnant.

Some days after his encounter with Lao Ping, Maoqiu trotted to the inn owner and gave him a chest filled with gold. At first, the inn owner was reluctant to sell, but Maoqiu made it very clear it wasn’t a negotiation but a demand. After acquiring the place, he went to Lao Ping and offered him and his family an opportunity to take over the inn. His daughter and husband welcomed the idea, but Lao Ping was very prideful and refused Maoqiu several times.

One night, Maoqiu embarked on a last attempt to convince Lao Ping. After drinking into the night, a drunk Maoqiu grabbed the old man, transformed into the white condor, and whisked him into the starless night sky. The old man, who grew up hearing the stories of his forefather and how he had witnessed General Xiang Liu, in his white robe pristine against the sun, riding into battle with his white condor, finally agreed, in fright and awe, to run the inn for Maoqiu but did not wish to own it, to which Maoqiu agreed. Lao Ping never told his daughter and son-in-law the truth, but they were ecstatic their father had changed his mind. Long gone were the days of poverty for Lao Ping's family.

Over the next ten years, Maoqiu and Fang Feng Wuming would share many encounters in Qingqiu, exchanging pleasantries. Wuming made a habit of visiting once a month. He would barge his way in the Northern Tavern to sit silently with Maoqiu, drinking tea while overlooking the cityscape below the tavern balcony. He often visited, dressed simply in plain robes, with a silver butterfly fluttering and nestled in his hair bun. In those times, Maoqiu will stare at the young man, working hard to pierce through the illusion, just for another glimpse of the young woman behind this visage. Just when Maoqiu was about to find a trick, Wuming suddenly bids farewell, and breaks his concentration. Yet, despite all his curiosity, Maoqiu didn't bother to investigate further. It felt too bothersome and he didn't want to implicate Lao Ping's family, hence, whatever devious plans Wuming is brewing should bring them harm, they wouldn't be implicated.

One day, without warning, Maoqiu was awakened in the dead of the night. There were people screaming, shouting. He rushed to his window and opened it to see the sky, bright orange. Like beacon torches, several places all over Qingqiu were ablaze. The smoke funneled into the sky, spreading a dark mask across the skyline. The wind, carrying the smell of burnt wood and charred debris, whipped through the streets of Qingqiu. In the distance, the rhythm of the guards tramping throughout the town could be heard. In the sky, guards on winged horses, carrying water, flew in from all directions. His neighbors poked through their windows and front doors, while others, not too far from the comfort of their homes, filled the alleys in fear and curiosity. In one direction, the Fang Feng Bei estate blazed the brightest, its yellow-orange embers rising into the air and disappearing into the night sky. The full moon, brightly illuminated and crimson red, hung in the backdrop of the Bei estate.

He didn't know why, but instinctively he was about to summon his spiritual mist power, determined to help Fang Feng Wuming. Right before his condor form materialized, a weak voice emerged from the darkness of his bedroom, “Don't go…” With a quick puncture of his sharp claw on his finger, Maoqiu quickly called forth his crimson blade, pointing it in the direction of the voice, cautiously stepping back in his room. Out of the shadow, Fang Feng Wuming stepped, clutching his side, still wearing the dog mask.

“Who are you?”

“Who do you think I am?” Fang Feng Wuming smirked weakly, walking straight into Maoqiu’s blade, taking off the dog mask.

“Aren't you afraid of death?”

“It depends on whose hands I am dying from,” he challenged, his eyes piercing and clear.

Maoqiu noticed Wuming was seriously injured and pulled away his sword. The moment he recalled his blood, Wuming collapsed into Maoqiu’s arms.

 nathsketch:

Yes, this is very true. It's hard to watch but it is considerably closer to what really happened to those who were caught during the Cultural Revolution. So, she should probably watch the first ten minutes of the first episode.

The novel covered Ye Wenjie's father's fate (and her mother and sister's accusations) in painful detail in Chapter 1. This has not happened yet in the Cdrama as of Ep3. Is it covered in the drama later? Would you say that it was watered down, or was the horror of the events just as well conveyed, without resorting to the portrayal of graphic violence? 

The Cdrama boasts a very strong cast. Even if Yu Hewei is not what I envisioned Shi Qiang to be from the novel, Zhang Luyi embodies Wang Miao for me. What is your opinion of the casting and their performances? Do you feel that they remain true to the essence of the characters they portray? 

@AH

This poem is really beautiful... and suitable for Xiang Liu T_T

 AH :

Lol, you and me both.

I'm glad I'm not alone!

 AH :

But she feels that only an adaptation produced outside of mainland China would faithfully adapt what happened to Ye Wenjie's father. We had family in China in '89 in the aftermath of Tiananmen Square and family that took in refuges who were blacklisted. So she's interested to see that part of the story without censorship interference.

I can't speak to this as I have not watched the depiction of the Cultural Revolution in the drama yet. It doesn't follow the sequence in the novel, but I am given to understand it is covered, though I have no idea when. Sometimes I wonder whether an in-your-face portrayal of gratuitous violence is far more impactful than implications of the violence being left to the imagination. I personally dislike senseless depiction of violence simply for the shock factor which has become so prevalent in the media nowadays, but I concede that in some cases, it is necessary. Will see if the drama's portrayal is faithful to the novel's description when I get to the scene.

 AH :

Ooh I like that explanation too! Especially since the dream was specifically about the ice crystal ball and the big-bellied laughing doll's creation. 

This is again another example of different interpretations based on the same text. Thankfully my interpretation doesn't sound too far-fetched for you as the author!

 AH :

ong Hua didn't describe what happened to Ah Heng and Chi You's souls after they disappeared from XY's sight and I kind of like that she left the next step open to interpretation, apart from the fact that, whatever it involved, it was something that they faced together. 

Yes. What truly mattered, and what comforts us as viewers from that scene (and yours) is that in the end, they are together, whatever comes afterwards, if there is an "afterwards" for them. 

 AH :

the idea of an eternal afterlife... it's not a thought that appeals to me. 

That is an interesting idea. To be honest, I never actually thought of them existing eternally together. Perhaps similar to you, the fact that they were finally reunited, was what mattered most for me. What I could not bear, is the thought of them waiting in vain, or continuing on in an existence with the knowledge that there is no hope of ever seeing each other anymore, especially if it is an existence that is filled with regrets.

 AH :

If XL and XY's souls went on one final journey together that ended with the particles that made up each of their souls being scattered across nature, but with parts of each of their souls joined together for eternity, I'd be satisfied with that.

I cheated and found out which novel the quote was from. I've not read Philip Pullman's books (though I did watch "The Golden Compass" years ago) - my fantasy fare was more Louise Cooper, David Eddings, Mercedes Lackey, Anne McCaffrey, Brandon Sanderson, among others. It's beautifully, achingly written - thank you so much for sharing it.  I particularly love Mary Elizabeth Frye's poem - it's tender and comforting, especially for those who are grieving. 

I don't even need a part of them to be together after their souls disperse. I would be happy with them just finally openly acknowledging and expressing their love for each other, for the first and last time, before their souls found rest. Which is why your ending brought me so much needed closure at a time when Tong Hua left such a gaping wound.

 plor20:

The world I am building is called Pajhuam Tebchaws (The land of poetry). I am also using the Hmong language as an extinct language that can conjure up magic. So far the tentative title is called 'The General's Concubine.' The themes I am exploring will be around the institutions of patriarchy, marriage, friendship, and love (but mostly what men will do to lay claim to what they believe they are entitled to)

This sounds interesting, plor. The themes are intriguing. I enjoyed reading about your writing process - the beginning and end first and then fleshing out the middle. One of my childhood dreams was to be a successful writer. Note the word successful. Lol! I was practical even as a child - I need to be able to eat and keep a roof over my head, I thought. Unfortunately, I have no writing ability. Worse, I have zero creativity *sigh*. Too practical :-)

 plor20:

Maoqiu encountered him one fateful day as he was personally delivering a pair of delicate silver hairpins to Tu Shan Zhen's new bride.

Looks like Tushan Zhen is accumulating a harem to rival Cang Xuan's! Is it to cement familial ties with all the powerful clans which would be beneficial to the Tushan business network? Or does he take after his father, with an eye for the ladies?

 plor20:

His ancestors made it a family tradition to name their eldest son Ping, as an ironic reminder that peace cost their patriarch’s life.

I presume Lao Ping refers to 老平 Old Ping? Assuming his surname was 李 Li, does it mean that every eldest son in that generation (or son-in-law) would be called 李平 Li Ping? To be honest, there is no tradition of naming every oldest son as a single character, because it would then indicate that every generation, there is someone with the same name. Unlike their Western counterparts, there is no similar naming convention such as Li Ping I, Li Ping II, Li Ping III etc. Traditionally, a Chinese character would be used to represent a generation in that family, so every child (or at least every boy) of that generation would have that word as a part of their names. For example, If the word for that generation of the 沈 Shen family was 瑞 Rui, then every child would inherit that word in their name e.g. 沈瑞阳 Shen Rui Yang, 沈瑞明 Shen Rui Ming, etc.

So realistically, it might make more sense for every oldest son to have the word Ping as part of their name, rather than their whole name. Just my 2 cents.

 plor20:

After drinking into the night, a drunk Maoqiu grabbed the old man, transformed into the white condor, and whisked him into the starless night sky.

This reminds me of the wild flight he subjected Xiao Liu to, so many years ago. Maoqiu is so reminiscent of his master, except for one glaring difference - he is certainly much richer than that poorer than church mice nine-headed demon. And such a cool, and clearly effective method to convince Lao Ping to fall in with his plans!

 plor20:

“Who are you?”

“Who do you think I am?” Fang Feng Wuming smirked weakly, walking straight into Maoqiu’s blade, taking off the dog mask.

“Aren't you afraid of death?”

“It depends on whose hands I am dying from,” he challenged, his eyes piercing and clear.

This dialogue and setup just brings back all the feels... different people, yet intrinsically connected to the ones who first spoke those words. And the scene reminds me of another time in Xuan Yuan city, when another wounded person sought refuge in a certain Gao Xin princess' chambers. You keep me intrigued as ever. Why was the Fangfeng Bei estate on fire? Was it Huayu, or someone else who was after her? I still have a hard time reconciling this elusive, mysterious woman with the mischievous demon who later called him Master and mock-complained of dying from hunger in Chapter 1. 

Thank you for sharing. Can't wait to find out more!

 plor20:

Lao Ping was a low level deity, but somehow had managed to live a longer life than he had expected. He was hunched a bit with white gray hairs and talked with a rasp. His daughter and son in law were ordinary and common in every way. His ancestors made it a family tradition to name their eldest son Ping, as an ironic reminder that peace cost their patriarch’s life.

I am reminded of Mulan's fake name in the old animated disney adaptation of her legend. ^^

This would be 平? Meaning "peaceful" (or level / even)?

 plor20:

Maoqiu encountered him one fateful day as he was personally delivering a pair of delicate silver hairpins to Tu Shan Zhen's new bride. Maoqiu doesn't remember why, but he had an urge to eat a bowl of noodles, and just so happened to see Lao Ping’s stall. While eating and pondering how he had lost count of how many women Tu Shan Zhen had taken in

That's an unexpected relationship. Is TSZ helping these women? Or being licentious?

 plor20:

“Who are you?”

“Who do you think I am?” Fang Feng Wuming smirked weakly, walking straight into Maoqiu’s blade, taking off the dog mask.

“Aren't you afraid of death?”

“It depends on whose hands I am dying from,” he challenged, his eyes piercing and clear.

 nathsketch:

Yes, this is very true. It's hard to watch but it is considerably closer to what really happened to those who were caught during the Cultural Revolution. So, she should probably watch the first ten minutes of the first episode.

Everything else is a far cry from the Cdrama, except maybe the VR equipment. It has a very cool design and it is much more practical than the one they used in the Chinese version. But with a budget of 20 million dollars per episode, some things would necessarily have to be better, even if only in the set design and props department :D

 liddi:

The Cdrama boasts a very strong cast. Even if Yu Hewei is not what I envisioned Shi Qiang to be from the novel, Zhang Luyi embodies Wang Miao for me.

Good to know. Thanks!

 liddi:

The novel covered Ye Wenjie's father's fate (and her mother and sister's accusations) in painful detail in Chapter 1. This has not happened yet in the Cdrama as of Ep3. Is it covered in the drama later?

 liddi:

I can't speak to this as I have not watched the depiction of the Cultural Revolution in the drama yet. It doesn't follow the sequence in the novel, but I am given to understand it is covered, though I have no idea when.

My understanding is that the novel was originally published in Mandarin chapter by chapter, and the writer and his editors chose to move the release of the cultural revolution parts from the beginning to the middle of the story due to concerns of censorship. And the English translation moved those parts back to their originally intended spot at the beginning of the story. So maybe it would make sense that the non-Chinese adaptation would have that part at the beginning of the drama, and maybe the Chinese adaptation of the drama will cover it in some form in the middle the way it was covered in the source material?

 liddi:

Sometimes I wonder whether an in-your-face portrayal of gratuitous violence is far more impactful than implications of the violence being left to the imagination. I personally dislike senseless depiction of violence simply for the shock factor which has become so prevalent in the media nowadays, but I concede that in some cases, it is necessary.

Agreed. 

 liddi:

 AH :
Ooh I like that explanation too! Especially since the dream was specifically about the ice crystal ball and the big-bellied laughing doll's creation.
This is again another example of different interpretations based on the same text. Thankfully my interpretation doesn't sound too far-fetched for you as the author!

I think this just goes to show that sometime's a reader's imagined explanation for canon events can be as good as, or even better than, the explanation that the author imagined. 

 liddi:

Yes. What truly mattered, and what comforts us as viewers from that scene (and yours) is that in the end, they are together, whatever comes afterwards, if there is an "afterwards" for them.

 liddi:

them just finally openly acknowledging and expressing their love for each other

Exactly. Truly together - with no more fear, secrets or noble intentions between them. Finally able to be fully open with one another about their feelings.

 liddi:

I cheated and found out which novel the quote was from. I've not read Philip Pullman's books (though I did watch "The Golden Compass" years ago) - my fantasy fare was more Louise Cooper, David Eddings, Mercedes Lackey, Anne McCaffrey, Brandon Sanderson, among others. It's beautifully, achingly written - thank you so much for sharing it.

I loved his books. So much so that I don't think I'll ever be able to watch a movie or TV adaptation. They cannot possibly live up to how the books played out in my imagination. I could probably trace my love of bittersweet endings with great self-sacrifice to them. 

I'll have to check those authors out on goodreads! ^^

 liddi:

I particularly love Mary Elizabeth Frye's poem - it's tender and comforting, especially for those who are grieving.

 ZYHLJ:

@AH



This poem is really beautiful... and suitable for Xiang Liu T_T

I'm glad you enjoyed it!

 liddi:

I don't even need a part of them to be together after their souls disperse. I would be happy with them just finally openly acknowledging and expressing their love for each other, for the first and last time, before their souls found rest. Which is why your ending brought me so much needed closure at a time when Tong Hua left such a gaping wound.

Ditto. You put it so nicely. 

It gave me closure to write it. I'm glad it gave you some too!