START-UP rants, discussions, facts, ANYTHING

 Zelle:

honestly if not for KSH, HJP will be any other characters that has been present in kdramaland.. KSH and the younger counterpart played HJP with such earnest..

yup!

 Kimsamsoom:

HJP actually gives SDM a lot of space both physically and emotionally. In terms of blind love, I think both men are blind, as I don't see the appeal of SDM. I see the appeal of both NDS and HJP though.

Yeah that bedroom scene between NDS and HJP was wrong on both their parts. I'm not saying HJP doesn't have flaws, because he does, but they are easier to ignore.

space? i dont think so..... [that confession even knowing that dalmi is at a crossroads with what she felt and he had to add to that even tho he said that it's not for her to be confused]

and why it's easier to ignore HJp's?

 Zelle:

Maybe because most HJP fans sees that the writer 'attempts' to fix NDS's characterization.. but for me, it's not entirely the case. I admit i'm a dodal ftw fan, but it doesn't necessarily meant that im totally biased over nds.. i still could still hjp's strengths and in as much see them equally

Well, to be an NDS fan or HJP fans is to admit bias off the bat. It's how you justify your bias that enumerates the depth of your bias. 

Like I said, both men have their flaws, it's how they dealt with their flaws which has fans divided. Also a big part of the dislike of NDS was from that scene where SDM ask for personal space, and NDS didn't give it, and leaving her in the dark park to get a suit is a no-no. I think in that episode, a LOT of people shifted over to HJP side, because a lot of girls watch KDrama and for most of us girls, that's a huge red flag from our SO.

A lot of people, also do not like how weak NDS makes SDM's character. What started as a strong capable SDM, eventually turned into a "save me please NDS" character, which in this modern day of Kdrama, a lot of audience do not like.

It's one thing to have a weak FL from the start compared to a strong FL from the start, that is weakened by the ML.

 Kimsamsoom:

A lot of people, also do not like how weak NDS makes SDM's character. What started as a strong capable SDM, eventually turned into a "save me please NDS" character, which in this modern day of Kdrama, a lot of audience do not like.

how did NDS makes SDm's character weak?

That's the thing though, MOST fans considered the stalking/following thing A LOT worse, than the HJP confession scene. So it's more of an mirror of how society thinks than anything.

1. He admits he aint a suitable CEO.

Techinically, he only admits it after HJP slams him for even considering it, and he finally relents. But he did not readily accept it. Plus him giving the reigns of CEO to SDM has more to do about his burgeoning feelings for SDM than her capabilities as one.

2. He praises others because of a great idea.

No, he only praises SDM, which again is tied to his feelings for her. His business decisions have all been solely because of his feelings for SDM and his belief in her. Something that is dangerous in the real world.

3. He don't do jealousy acts just to piss the other party.

The scene in Halmoni's house?

4. He says sorry countless of times because she was hurt.

Once again, it's all SDM centric, and never to other people.

5. Although others may not see it, even though he's jealous, he uses that to improve his craft.

These are some of the things he did in the story.

Yes, he used his jealousy to get an upper hand, which eventually caused SST to break up. 

If your argument is that he does good things for SDM, then I agree, he's a sweeties pie. But a mark of a good person is not how they treat their friends, but how they treat their enemies/strangers.

NDS character doesn't come of as wholly selfless or holistic, and the writer trying to shove this characterization down our throats at such a late stage is feeling quite frightening.

 Kristances:

(damn, i miss the NDS-HJP bromance) 

sameeee! also the national anthem scene.. hayyys.

also others may see nds as weak just cause he's crying more than dalmi.. but for me it shows a different kind of vulnerability and the struggle nds has within him. Is it that bad to question yourself and compare to the likes of HJP who you see as someone who has it all. Let's not factor in how NDS has friends and family whilst HJP is an orphan.. but more of as an individual. He doubts himself ever since he acted on the letter NDS and to the countless insults kinda harsh comments from HJP.

Yeah ofc, different people have different interpretations. But it appears that on MDL, majority sees it similar to me.

NDS may not be planning on being that Knight in Shining Armor, but the writers have written him as such. Even when there is no need to be, he does it anyway. This is most clearly seen on Demo Day. WIJ, was given a tough tough question by an aggressive heckler in NDS dad, she paused a second, thought about it, then delivered a strong answer. SDM was asked a question that was actually not too difficult, by a less aggressive person in Alex, and she froze. She may have been able to answer eventually, but we'll never know.

1. I felt that was more of NDS way of convincing Yong San and Cheul San. This point is further proved when he later vetoes the SST boys plan to find another CEO. It's akin to saying, "ok guys, i'll do whatever you guys decide" SST chooses same as NDS. SST then changes mind, "Nope, you guys already said yes, no backsies". If he really cared what the other SST boys thought, he would actually look at it from a logical perspective, something he WAS known to do all his life. But instead, he allows emotion to cloud his judgement, which has been happening for most of the series. NDS biggest enemy are his emotions.

2. If HJP is weird in that sense, then SDM is even weirder, blocking potential BF's because of a fake penpal. Difference of HJP and NDS is, if SDM is going to enter the fire, make mistakes, HJP, regardless of his feelings will tell her the brutal truth. It's been shown that regardless of his emotions, he will say the truth, regardless if it hurts. NDS is the complete opposite. He would rather tell sweet lies to avoid the person getting hurt, or sugar coat the truth, then to be honest and just prevent SDM from making the mistake. Big difference here.

3. This is HJP's lowest point, and really to be honest, so inconsistent with his character prior to this scene. I wasn't a fan of this scene.

4.  I have an issue of how NDS treats his parents, it's really ungrateful. In episode 9, after having an emotional scene of how he is failing his parents, literally hours later, he is having good times with SDM's family. Then hours later he is telling his dad "I always disappoint you, no matter how hard I try, or how well I do". This is the blame game, not an apology. Really unfair of NDS here. I actually write a more detailed assessment of NDS and his family in the comment section if you want to read it. 

Yes, in the early episodes, NDS was still good and people was making comments like, "I like both leads, I don't care who SDM ends up with". Then the writers ruined him, and now a majority of fans really dislike NDS.

5. Wasn't sure about Zelles point here as well hahaha!

It may appear equally wrong to you and other NDS fans, but majority of HJP fans feels NDS is on more of a declining slope every episode, while HJP's slope just keeps getting higher and higher. And as I said to zelle, the better the characterization, the easier it is to ignore the faults.

The fact that the NDS supporters have become niche, just goes to show that the writer had a disconnect with the character she created. She did not give him enough mass audience appeal to be likeable, or he gave the second lead too much great characterization.

Take out the sad orphan backstory, and I believe there will still be more HJP fans.