Xiang Liu and Xiao Yao’s Story and Romance

@kokuto

"My understanding was that he used the Lovers Bug to keep XY from dying completely and then used blood magic, his blood and a life to save her"

It's the first time I am hearing this theory, but honestly I have a hard time making sense of it. I mean I don't remember anything in the novel or în the drama that points to the fact that XL has the power to revive people. He did manage to save XY,  but she wasn't completely dead, the bugs, as you said, kept her alive. Killing CX by killing her and revive her afterwards it's completely different. 

I don't know, but I personally don't see any other option XL or XY had at that time to get the bug out of CX without turning bad for XY. 

Hello everybody hope y'all doing good =)

 Kimiya78:

1) In episode 37 of the drama XY said that XL was controlling the bug (when seeing Jing) Could XL control the bug only cuz XY had turned into a monster otherwise he wasn't able to do so?

No.  Whoever has the higher / stronger spiritual power can control the Bug.  If they relatively equal in power, then I believe they both can control the Bug.  XL has the higher spirit power.

 Kimiya78:

Once I read that XY had a covert reason by calling XL to visit her (in episode 6 cuz of brothel issue except for the obvious reason she told XL) is that true or I misunderstood? if yes what she truly intended? And how come XL cause her to fall off the tree?

Where did you read about this covert reason?   When you are talking about "covert" or subtext or ambiguous meanings, there isn't always a single TRUE answer.  There are answers that may have more textual evidence or logical conclusions, but often there is evidence for numerous takes.  As you can tell, there are various takes discussed here that don't reach a consensus.

XL was punishing / getting revenge for her drawing the eyes on his face, while he was immobilized and healing.

 Kimiya78:

3) In episode 7, What was the reason that XL was not in a good mood? XY asked it, tbh I could not think of any.

Wasn't it because of his men were dying of some illness?

 Kimiya78:

4) I guess it was in episode 8, XL wanted XY to ask Jing for some herbs, well he mentioned sth about like killing sb. I did not get that he would kill whom for who exactly?

XY asked XL what he could offer Jing for the herbs.  XL said he didn't have money to pay for the herbs, but he said he in exchange he could refuse any assassination offer from Tushan Hou to kill Jing.

 Kimiya78:

5) The prostitute that Skinny fell in love with once said to XY that someone had offered her a sum of money to seduce Skinny. Well do you have any idea about the person behind that?

Wasn't that CX who was behind that?

 Kimiya78:

1) In episode 37 of the drama XY said that XL was controlling the bug (when seeing Jing) Could XL control the bug only cuz XY had turned into a monster otherwise he wasn't able to do so? 

 Kokuto:

No.  Whoever has the higher / stronger spiritual power can control the Bug.  If they relatively equal in power, then I believe they both can control the Bug.  XL has the higher spirit power.

I would like to clarify this point. Many people think that XL can control the bug. However, the lovers' bug is a pair of bug: 1 male and 1 female with equal strength and the one who raises the bug can't control the bug. XL can't not control the bug in XY's body and vice versa. Because of his high spiritual power level and the demon nature which can be closes to bug, he can control the bug in his own body. Thus he can activate certain action on his own bug which sends the signal to XY's bug and causing effect on XY. For example when XY felt heart beat abnormal in that eps, XL had to made his heart beat increased first. And XL also had the ability to supress the signal-transfer from his bug to XY's bug. Thus most of the time he supressed the signal transfer and XY mostly didn't sense him. However, there was some time he did not supress this signal transfer (when he lowdowned his selft-guard or very relaxed). For example  XY could sense XL coming from the sea when she was in the dragon bone prison (after CX captured WXL); she told YQS brought her to the beach; during 37 years she could sense him via the bug

 Kokuto:

 Kimiya78:
Once I read that XY had a covert reason by calling XL to visit her (in episode 6 cuz of brothel issue except for the obvious reason she told XL) is that true or I misunderstood? if yes what she truly intended? And how come XL cause her to fall off the tree?
Where did you read about this covert reason?   When you are talking about "covert" or subtext or ambiguous meanings, there isn't always a single TRUE answer.  There are answers that may have more textual evidence or logical conclusions, but often there is evidence for numerous takes.  As you can tell, there are various takes discussed here that don't reach a consensus.

XL was punishing / getting revenge for her drawing the eyes on his face, while he was immobilized and healing.

I don't understand your question @Kimiyao78. That meeting between WXL and XY was initiated by WXL months after the event which she drew charcoal on his face. There are some reason for that: she knew that there was some powerful person controlled Sang Tian Er and blocking the purchase her out of the brothel. The remanant army had the spying network in the town, thus, she could ask XL about the information. another reason is she missed him. There were a scene that she looked at the mirror and happily laughted while staying alone in her room. I also thought of another reason that later she told YSQ. She wanted to introduce the bug to XL via the blood. Thus she wanted to make him trust her. That was why even she fell on the ground, got her leg broken at the end of the meeting, she was still happy. 

XL was angry at XY because she came to ask his help. However, seeing his reaction when she asked about the brothel, she knew that the remanant army and XL did not involved the case. Thus, she could guess it was Xuan. If XL had helped her, Xuan would have different opinion about her and thought she had connection with the resistant army. She wanted to stay away from political conflict. XL thought that she did not value and play trick on him, regard him as the snake to entertain in her story. So, he punished her by using spiritual power to cut the tree branch

 Kokuto:

 Kimiya78:
3) In episode 7, What was the reason that XL was not in a good mood? XY asked it, tbh I could not think of any.
Wasn't it because of his men were dying of some illness?

XL was in bad mood because he heard the conversation of some soldiers in his army about him. I had request to increase the security and intensive guarding because of intrusion by CX's guard where they attacked him. However, those soldiers were not pleased and they said it was him as the most subspious and they did not have respect to him becaue of his demon origin. 

 Kokuto:

 Kimiya78:
5) The prostitute that Skinny fell in love with once said to XY that someone had offered her a sum of money to seduce Skinny. Well do you have any idea about the person behind that?
Wasn't that CX who was behind that?

Yes, Xuan was behind the scheme. 

 Kimiya78:

Woww dude such a cool opinion :o Well the way you see/interpret the drama gives me the feeling that I did not get anything even though I've watching the drama (predominantly XL's every single scene) over and over so far LOL. "But how can our proud Lord Xiang Liu admit this? impossible! It's someone else you're chatting with, but Xiang Liu hasn't forgiven you yet! " honestly this very sentence of you got me literally wow lol I mean some of your views empress me like hell :)

You should check out the topic that @ZYHLJ started.  Talking about world building and some ficlets.

https://mydramalist.com/discussions/lost-you-forever/122013-why-not-create-the-dahuang-world-together-waiting-is-hard-but-doesn-t-have-to-be-boring

 liddi:

Wishing all who celebrate a very blessed Lunar New Year! While certainly not as coiffed and cool as Xiang Liu, this does reflect my journey from the frazzled look of CNY preparations leading up to the transformation on the first day of the New Year LOL

Happy Lunar New Year Liddi!! 

Awwww so pretty!! I'm still waiting for mine :D

 liddi:

Looks like S2 might be airing this month or early March after all? Can't wait! Will we all still be here dissecting the drama and novel long after S2 finally ends?

I hope that's just a rumor :O I saw nothing being mentioned on Weibo, only a couple of suspicious-looking posts. One of them mentioned something about February 20. That's less than 10 days from now!! It can't be, can it??

@Kokuto, @Blabla100 & @ZYHLJ,

I have followed our discussion lately. There were so many points that it would take some time to trace and quote all or some of your point. We had debate about XL's motivation and intention when he accepted the transfer of the bug from CX to himself. My interpretation at that time was mainly based on the novel. 

Lately you have talked about the drama and there are difference between the drama and the novel, thus in this post I am going to discuss the bug and his intention in the drama. 

If I remember correctly, XL came to ask Lirong veteran in eps 11. After that he collaborated with FFYY to assasinate CX and then he asked WXL why did not he remove the bug and got known that WXL had tried to remove the bug but WXL failed to call back the bug. He told WXL not to do it unless she wanted to die. 

It is very normal that XL wanted to know all the information about the nature of the bug and all situations such as planting or removing the bug. He wanted to understand everything about the bug so that he could be in the best position and well-prepared if he had to cope/deal with that issue. @HeadInTheClouds had pointed this out in her post. 

Here is my grab about the bug in the drama (Keep in my that the bug in the drama is not the same as in the novel)

1. XL told Lirong veteran about the sympton that he had observed between WXL and CX: 

XL: Recently I met a poison bug. It's very strange. It can make the receiver suffer the same pain as the one who places it. Conversely, if the receiver is injured, it has no effect on the one who places it. But the one who places it can neither control the bug at will. nor recall it. 

LR veteran:Is the one who places the bug is a girl?

 XL: Why are you asking this?

LR: If it is really a girl. It's likely a pair of couple poison bugs planted for her lover.

XL: Couple poison bugs?

The property which made the receiver suffer the same pain as the one who places it but if the receiver is injured it has no effect on the one who places it is typical property of general bug such as the mother-child bug. WXLtold Jing that the bug would not harm him, thus the orange information about the bug was what he had heard from the conversation between Jing and WXL. Moreover, WXL thought the bug was normal poison bug or he didn't know clearly about the bug. 

 The crucial reason which made Lirong veteran think of lovers's bug in this case is "the one who places it can neither control the bug at will or recall it".  He asked XL about the gender of the raiser if it was a girl because the lovers' bug was mainly raised by women for her lovers. XL did not answer about the gender. He thought WXL was female because she could lure fei fei. That was his animal instinct. However her transformation was so seemless that a low spiritual power person could not do. The question about the gender of the raiser supported his animal instinct thought about female gender of WXL. 

2. The properties of the bug in the drama: 

离戎老伯：传说中有一种极其难养的雌雄蛊。一雌一雄，力量相当。施蛊者便无法控制蛊虫。这种情况大都是女子养来种给情郎的，求的是一心一意，永不相负。一旦种上，便同命连心，生死相随，所以又叫做情蛊。
相柳：如果彼此无情，能种蛊吗。
离戎老伯：哎呦，不行不行不行。不过蛊术之道神秘莫测，也许能种吧。但即便勉强种下也是后患无穷，不但不能同命连心，还可能被蛊虫反噬，危及性命啊。
相柳：怎么解蛊
离戎老伯：种蛊要靠情意，解蛊也要靠情意。如果种蛊时间不长，趁其根基未稳，也可能将蛊移到另一个人身上。但另一个人必须心中有情才行。情蛊这东西啊，不但要命还要心。你命是有九条，但心只有一颗。一旦给了出去，可就再也收不回来了。

LROM: Legend has it there are male-female poisonous bugs which are very difficult to cultivate. One is male, the other is female, with equal power. The one who raises them cannot control the poisonous bug. Mostly women raise it for their lovers, hoping for a love that is devoted (one heart, one mind), never betraying each other. Once it is planted, the couple's hearts and fates/lives are joined, living and dying together. As such, it is also called love poisonous bug.
XL: If there is no love between the couple, would it be possible to plant the bug?
LROM: No, no, no. However, the art of poisonous bugs is mysterious and unpredictable. Perhaps it is possible. Even so, forcibly planting it will lead to endless troubles. Not only are they unable to join their hearts together and share the same fates/lives, but the poisonous bugs may retaliate against them and harm their lives.
XL: How can they be removed?
LROM: The planting of the bug relies on love, as does its removal. If it has not been planted for long, it is possible to transfer it to another person while its foundation has not yet stabilised. However, the other person must have love in his heart. The love poisonous bug demands not only your life but your heart. You have nine lives, but only one heart. Once your heart is given, you can never take it back.

Note: 

• The text here was translated by Liddi based on the chinese subtitle
• In the drama the lirong veteran called the bug as 情蛊 - love poisonous bug. however in the novel the bug was call 情人蛊  = lovers' poisonous bug  

As we see here, the key characteristics of the bug 

In the case of lovers couple:

• A pair of male and female bug with equal strength
• The raiser could not control the bug (while in the case of ordinary bug the raiser could control the bug in the receiver's body)
•  the couple's hearts and fates/lives are joined, living and dying together

And in the case if there is no love between the couple: 

•  forcibly planting it will lead to endless troubles. 
• Not only are they unable to join their hearts together and share the same fates/lives, but the poisonous bugs may retaliate against them and harm their lives.

3. Which kind of bug connection between XL and XY. 

First, the requirement for removing the bug from CX to another on is that one must have love in his heart. Thus, the successful removal of the bug from CX to him proved that XL did love WXL/XY. Planting required love. Thus does it mean in order to plant successfully on XL, there was love from WXL too? Moreover, the bug stayed in both of them for more than 100 years without any trouble. XL could use his life to keep XY alive, use one of his lives to extend her life. The bug did not retaliate against them and harm their lives. All of this prove that the bug was planted successfully and the bugs behaved as they were shared between a lovers couple. --> Therefore, there must be love for XL in WXL/XY's heart. 

4. What was XL's intention when he accept WXL's ask for moving the bug to him?

• First, he loved WXL. Their chat by the river about how WXL got the bug and her effort to call the bug back regardless his advice showed WXL was very reckless and did not know the all the detail of the bugs. 
• Her recklessness could harm her live (also CX's life. Thus he wanted to protect her by moving the bug to him
• WXL said she prepared the bug for him and the only person that she wanted to scourge was XL. He could have wonder if she raised and wanted to plant it on him (first purpose) as for "her lover".  Her care for him (didn't want him to die), their interaction made him think that there might be love from her too. Accepting the bug could give him the answer about WXL's real feeling to him. 

The removal and re-planting on XL was successful (the walnut was gone, they had the same heart beat). In the drama, XL looked very happy and relax during the excursion under the sea. His eyes were full of love and very tender manner (the novel just mentioned that he was relax, care-free).  He got the answer about WXL's feeling for him. 

---------------------------------------------

5. Did XL have intention about future with WXL?

In my opinion, XL had intention for future with WXL. What kind of future and how long would it be?

The drama added a line " The love poisonous bug demands not only your life but your heart. You have nine lives, but only one heart. Once your heart is given, you can never take it back" . Thus, accepting the bug also means a life-time committment, he could never take his heart back once it was given. The bug required heart, the girl planted the bug for her lover to hope for devoted love (one heart, one mind). Because the bugs demanded hearts, the bugs themselves were a couple poison bugs and they were like the guard, inspector to monitor if the hosts remained one heart - one mind to each other (devoted to each other). For more than 100 years, the bugs were in their heart thus it was the proof for their "one heart-one mind" (unchanged affection).

 When and how did he figure out method to kill the bug was not clearly mentioned or indicated in both drama and the novel. It is unlikely he knew it from the veteran. 

Unlike Jing, XL seemed to take time with the relationship with WXL. WXL had told him that she wanted to stay in QS forever. CX left. He could share a lot of time with WXL as friend first. The drama made the scene that FFB started making the bow for WXL right after removal of the bug. This implied that XL had plan to teach WXL archery since the time in QS town.  In my opinion, he would wait until WXL realized her true feeling to him and then show him her true appearance (girl's form). XL said he was not interested in her fake appearance. Once she did it, it would prove she fully trusted him and she loved him sufficient enough to make futher step.  He knew the fate of Sheng Nong army, Hongjang and the soldiers were pitiful people who did pitiful work. He had conscience for them however he knew some of them didn't respect him. he well predicted that oneday Xyan would rule the whole world. But the last 300 years, Hongjang's army could still exist. If there was no crucial change in the political landscape, the remanant army could survise a few hundred years more or even longer. So even temporary period of time for companion could last very very long. 

Together with the scene in eps 25 when FFB came to XY's room where TJC showed his hurt when XY refused to let him bite her neck. Revealing his true identity as XL indicated that XL make effort in the relationship. He could sense her heart and mind. He saw her effort and her mood via the poison that she made for him. if he just wanted to teach XY achery, he should have just taught her archery and then gone away from her life.