Xiang Liu and Xiao Yao’s Story and Romance

 MTH123:

I want to respond to your post, but I don't have time right now. In the meantime, I don't understand the distinctions you're making in the quote above. What is the difference between love and care-and-sense of camaraderie vs. filial, gratitude and repaying a debt?

孝顺 (filial piety / respect and obedience / xiao shun) is a virtue and an ethical obligation for sons and daughters to care for, respect and obey their parents and ancestors. Acts that show filial piety (think of how everyone considered "FFB" to be filial after he diligently cared for his mother for four years until she died) can sometimes be driven by love and affection. But even where there is no affection, a child is expected to be filial to their parents and failing to be filial would be seen as failing to fulfil an ethical duty and indicative of a lack of virtue. 

When I say that I don't think XL's choice is one that he makes out of filial obligation, I mean that I don't think XL chose to stick with the remnant army to the end and to die with them on the battlefield because he felt obligated to be filial to Gong Gong. 

When I say that I don't think XL's choice is one that he makes out of gratitude or to repay a debt, I again mean that I don't think XL chose to stick with the remnant army to the end and to die with them on the battlefield because of his gratitude towards Gong Gong or sense of indebtedness that made him feel obligated to repay Gong Gong. XL repaid his debt. Based on the text, that's not why he stayed or why he chose that ending. 

XL's relationship with Gong Gong evolved beyond the relationship of a debtor and creditor. Beyond a subordinate and superior. They were so close that they were like father and son. So much so that Gong Gong adopted XL. After that point, their bonds are bonds of love and affection (to use the words that Tong Hua uses, through XY). And Tong Hua tells us (through XY's thoughts) that the concept of repayment becomes irrelevant in that type of relationship. If XL's relationship had just remained one of a debtor and creditor, then after he had done enough to repay the debt, XL would have no further obligation to Gong Gong and no further ties with him. So there would be hope (from XY's perspective) that, at some point before Gong Gong's end, XL would be able to leave Gong Gong and have no further ties with him. But because XL's relationship with Gong Gong evolved and is now defined by love and affection, his loyalty and commitment to Gong Gong will never be "enough" to break that bond. It's no longer something he gives out of obligation to repay Gong Gong. It's something he freely chooses to give out of love.   

So I think that XL chose to stick with the remnant army to the end and to die with them on the battlefield because he loved Gong Gong and he felt a deep sense of camaraderie with his fellow soldiers. He did not want to abandon them. He did not want to be the lone survivor (like the one-armed man) who lived but was haunted by memories of his fellow soldiers. Unable to forget. He wanted to be loyal to them to the end. He wanted to die with them on the battlefield. "...he chose for himself the best ending!”

 MySiFeng:

Hi, new here!
I've been lurking here for quite some time and I need to let this out somewhere.

I heard many things about this drama before I watched it.
Along the way, I got to know in the book, they indeed love each other.
But as I watched the drama, while XL's expressions were super obvious, I didn't feel or notice anything from XY. It made his love feel one-sided and that contradicts the emotions I felt from reading the book.

Towards the end, I found myself FFs to FFB/XL scenes.

These few days, I've been reading the excerpts from the book here. I just feel disappointed with what they did to the drama.

And I just posted my opinion about THAT FOX being everywhere during XY and XL scenes on my Tumblr yesterday and someone reblogged and got defensive. 

Can't I express my view?  *shake head

Anyway, looking forward to S2, and seeing how they gonna butcher XL scenes. I'm here for XL crumbs.

Hello there! Welcome! First of all, I love your profile name and your opinions. Let it all out. Here we do some fox roastings weekly. If it was up to me, the frequency would be daily. BE GONE BORING FOX.

But what matters the most is that now you are officially 

The focus is on Yaoliu from the perspective of his grandfather, and the four years after they separated from Yaobei Xiaozhurong.

In almost every relationship in the book, there are bystanders who jump out of the perspective of the person involved in the story to more clearly portray the full picture of the character or event from the side.

The bystanders of Yaoxuan are like Huangdi and Xinyue, the bystanders of Yaojing are like Huangdi, Zhuanxu, and Fenglong, and the bystanders of Xuannian are like Huangdi, Jundi, and Xiaoyao.

The bystanders in Yaoliu include Emperor Jun, Chishui Xian, Anian, Junjun and Zhuanxu, as well as Huangdi who sees everything (my grandfather is actually the biggest melon owner in the book).

Huangdi's line is the longest observer's perspective.

Since both Yaoxuan and Yaojing are on the bright side, Xiaoyao will not be secretive when talking about them, and onlookers will have clear understanding and judgment; while Yaoliu is on the dark side, and Xiaoyao rarely talks about it with others. .

Xiaoyao and Xiaoliu have a common characteristic when they speak: they keep their words to themselves and only tell the part of the truth that can be heard. If Xiao Yao really said everything, it would be impossible to keep the secret that Fang Feng Bei was Xiang Liu until the end. She hid Xiang Liu and Fang Feng Bei from her relatives and friends, just like she hid her origins and relationship with Xuan from Xiang Liu in Qingshui Town. The approach is exactly the same.

The Zhuyanhua no longer has the function of transformation. Xiaoyao's face corresponds to Xiaoyao's identity, and Xiaoyao's identity means that she is restricted in what she says and does. She is almost never in front of her relatives and friends. When it comes to his feelings for Xiang Liu, everyone except Huang Di.

Perhaps because he knew that his grandfather felt guilty about his grandmother and mother, and felt indebted to himself, he became more careless. Perhaps because she cared more about Xiang Liu being Zhuan Xu's enemy, and my grandfather had given up his power and abdicated, so Xiang Liu was not considered his enemy. Perhaps because she had talked about her husband before, she had expressed her feelings in a joking way, so she was not as wary of her grandfather. She may even find that her grandfather can understand her and see through her thoughts, and she secretly hopes that this wise old man can give her some guidance and help.

Grandpa is actually the only person in this story who Xiaoyao will take the initiative to reveal even a little bit of his feelings for Xiang Liu.

Before writing about Yaoliu from Grandpa’s perspective, let’s first write about Xiaoyao from Grandpa’s perspective:

When Xiaoyao just returned to Yunfeng, Huangdi said:

"Huang Di stared at Xiao Yao for a while and sighed, "You have such a personality, completely opposite to your mother and your grandmother. "

Xiaoyao giggled and made a face at Huangdi, "What's the benefit of being like them? They just make men easier and hurt themselves!"

<1-15 Thinking about the past can easily lead to injury>

This is Huangdi's first impression of his granddaughter whom he has not seen for more than three hundred years. It is also the image Xiaoyao creates to the outside world. It is the way Xiaoyao lets himself show: I will not compromise my sincerity for a man.

But later, Huangdi often felt that Xiaoyao looked like her grandmother and mother.

“After the marriage is decided, it’s time to discuss the wedding date.

Jing thought the sooner the better...

Huangdi asked Xiaoyao what she thought about the wedding date.

Xiaoyao looked at the busy doctors outside the window, thought for a while , and said, "I want to wait until the compilation of medical books is clear before confirming the wedding date."

Huang Di said: " This is not a matter of two or three years . Are you sure?"

Xiaoyao nodded: "The "Shen Nong's Materia Medica" has been in my hands for more than four hundred years. It has saved my life, but I have never done anything for it. In other words, I want to taste all kinds of herbs for that person. Yandi, who died of poisoning, should do something. What he spent his whole life on should not become a tool for a few doctors to exchange money and fame. "

Huangdi sighed: "Xiaoyao, you keep saying that you are not like your mother, but in fact, you are very similar to your mother! "

Xiaoyao frowned: "I'm not like her!"

Huang Di smiled and said: "Okay, it doesn't look like it, it doesn't look like it!"

In the evening, when Zhuanxu came to Xiaoyueding, he heard Xiaoyao's decision on the wedding date and smiled: "Very good."

Maybe because she was engaged to Jing, Xiaoyao began to realize that her days in Xiaoyue Ding were limited, and the time she spent with Zhuanxu was not unlimited ; maybe it was because although Xuanyuan and Gao Xin had casualties in the war, no one knew Xiaoyao People died. If you don't inquire about it, you will hardly feel the war thousands of miles away. Xiaoyao no longer avoids Zhuanxu. The relationship between the two resumed . Every evening, Zhuanxu would come and spend some time talking and laughing with Xiaoyao. "

<3-5 The enemy is so close that nothing can be done>

Judging from the content of the conversation , Huangdi said that Xiaoyao is like Aheng, which means that her act of compiling medical books for the world is like her mother. No matter what she says, she still has great love in her heart. Although Xiaoyao really has it in her heart, This point of great love is doubtful.

But from the writing point of view, it has another meaning.

Here we first use contrast : Jing desperately wants to get married, while Xiaoyao "thought about it for a while" and decided to compile medical books first.

Then the topic changed . After getting engaged to Jing, "the time spent with Zhuanxu is not unlimited" and "restored the previous relationship" with Zhuanxu .

After this paragraph, the timeline is quickly drawn :

"The cold and summer come and go, and the peaceful days pass so quickly. Before I know it, eight years have passed."

<3-5 The enemy is so close that nothing can be done>

Next : Xiaoyao meets a man in brocade clothes on the road, chasing after chasing after catching Xiang Liu along the way.

According to the normal development of romance, if the author wants to highlight the love between two people, he must write about the interactions between them and their alone time together.

But what is the author doing? First, it compares how Jing was anxious after getting engaged while Xiao Yao was not anxious, and then writes about how the brother and sister get along, and then writes about Xiao Yao running into her ex-boyfriend and chasing her all the way, and a long paragraph about Xiao Yao recognizing Xiang Liu based on intuition alone. A plot that drives the plot forward. What exactly do you want to highlight?

You taste it, you taste it carefully.

Can’t medical books be revised in Qingqiu? Even when he married Fenglong, Fenglong said that he had arrived in Chishui:

"If you like to learn medical skills, you can continue to study. Even if you want to practice medicine in the future, I will definitely support you."

<2-14 Chasing the past makes me miserable>

So why can’t I study medical books after getting married? Qingqiu has no table or house? Isn’t the home of the richest man in Dahuang not big enough? Taking ten thousand steps back, Qingqiu just can't study medical books. After getting married, Xiaoyao will live in Xiaoyue Ding and continue to study medical books. Jing will never object even a word, right?

But the author just wanted to write. She said she wanted to study medicine first and then get married.

Very subtle.

Compare this to the last time Xiaoyao was about to marry Fenglong , she first sent an ice crystal ball to Xiang Liu, and then went to Qingqiu. What is this doing? Just like undoing poison and not making poison, if you really get married, you have to say goodbye to the past. Clean up the previous relationships.

Obviously, although Xiaoyao and Jing were engaged, she was not ready to get married. It is really necessary to study the medical books, but you must complete the medical books before getting married. It is very much like an excuse to delay marriage. Why delay? It's nothing more than that I am still thinking about someone in my heart and need to give myself time to let go and forget.

So much so that it took forty-two years for the medical book to be completed:

"Back at Shennong Mountain, Xiaoyao suddenly found that there was nothing to do, and she couldn't adapt.

Discuss with Jing: "Do you think I should go to Zezhou City to open a medical clinic?"

"But Zezhou is close and Qingqiu City is far away. It's inconvenient to go back and forth every day!"

"If you live in Qingqiu, Qingqiu City is definitely more convenient."

"Huh? I live in Qingqiu?" Xiaoyao still didn't react for a moment.

Jing said with a smile: "The Tushan Mansion in Qingqiu has already been packed and decorated, and the wedding can be held at any time."

<3-8 Passionate but always ruthless>

It can be seen almost clearly from this conversation that Xiaoyao wants companionship. Once she has adapted and got used to this companionship, it will not matter whether she gets married or not. Anyway, this person has been locked in.

Huangdi was happy to see the marriage between Xiaoyao and Jing. One of the reasons was naturally that he discovered that Zhuanxu had unusual feelings for Xiaoyao and wanted to end his thoughts about him quickly, otherwise he would become an infatuated emperor. What to do. He was different from Emperor Jun. Emperor Jun advised Xiaoyao to stay away from Xiang Liu because he wanted to protect Xiaoyao, while Emperor Huang wanted to protect his heir.

What about other reasons? Let me guess the old man's heart privately: Zhuanxu, you don't know, your sister has fallen in love with the devil Xiang Liu. If she doesn’t get married quickly, there’s no telling how many things will happen in the future!

Putting it this way, it feels like Huangdi is actually more anxious than Jing to get Xiaoyao to get married soon.

Therefore, when Huangdi said: "You and your mother are very similar" , another meaning is: you and your mother have the same vision, and they both fall in love with the person you shouldn't love.

Xiaoyao said she was afraid of men like Huangdi, Jundi and her brother, but in fact the type she loved was exactly the same as the one her mother and grandmother loved. It's hard to say what would have happened to Xiaoyao and her cousin if her cousin hadn't needed to use her power to push her to Jing and Fenglong at the beginning.

You don’t know it, but genes are really amazing, and their visions are all the same.

But besides Huangdi initially saying that Xiaoyao looked a bit like Alei, when he thought of Alei through Xiaoyao, it was mostly because of the state of Xiaoyao and Jing:

"Huang Di didn't know whether it was because he was old, or because Xiao Yao with his eyes closed looked too much like the young girl in his memory , Huang Di felt his eyes were a little sore. He made countless people happy in his life, but most of his relatives Unfortunately , like the sun, its radiance shines on the earth and makes all things grow, but those who are really close to the sun will be burned. He is already old, and the past cannot be traced, but now, he really hopes for the warmth of hugging under the locust tree It really lasts forever.”

<3-1 The east wind is evil and happiness is thin>

"Xiao Yao with lowered eyes looks so much like her! Huang Di seemed to see Xiao Yao in front of him guarding a lonely room and growing old rapidly. His hair was stained with flying frost, his flower-like face was withered, and he was aging in Chaoyun Palace. The lonely figure overlapped with Xiao Yao in front of him, and Huang Di couldn't bear to look at it anymore and suddenly closed his eyes."

<3-9 Hun Meng An Neng Ding>

Through Huangdi's perspective, we saw the peaceful years of Xiaoyao and Jing, and also saw the heavy blow that Jing's "death" brought to Xiaoyao. I saw that Jing could give Xiaoyao the stable life she wanted, and I also saw the overwhelming sadness after the huge hope was shattered.

But after reading "Zeng Xunuo", you will know what kind of relationship between Huangdi and Alei. Alei liked Huangdi, but Huangdi's feelings for her were not pure. But they have been together through thick and thin, and they have built the Xuanyuan Kingdom together. Even if it is not love, after all, the husband and wife still have a deep and complicated friendship when they work together.

"Huang Di seemed to have guessed what Xiao Yao was thinking, and said: "Your grandmother was once as young as you. Her beauty and talent were famous throughout the world. Many good men wanted to marry her, but unfortunately, she chose the wrong person . . ""

<1-15 Thinking about the past can easily lead to injury>

Huang Di believed that Ah Le had "chosen the wrong person" when she chose him , and he ended up feeling haggard and unhappy in his life. He hoped that Xiaoyao would get what Alei didn't get; there were too many factors mixed up between Alei and himself, and there was no real everlasting relationship. He hoped that Xiaoyao and Jing could "really" last forever; Xiaoyao lost Jing, and he I think of Ah Lei after she broke up with him, her hair stained with frost and her face withered.

I found it on another forum, what do you think?

One of the things I loved about Lost You Forever is that interpretation is unlimited. I've shared a perspective from my Hmong/Miao culture before, and I'd like to share another one: 'Blood Oath' (Hau Ntsha Tev).

In Hmong/Miao culture, blood oaths are strictly forbidden because they link two people for eternity. Even if you are ill-fated, a blood oath binds you to that person in the past, present, future, and in reincarnation. Blood oaths are considered dark omens; they are not for the faint of heart. This act is reserved for lovers who are willing to endure multiple tribulations.

The blood oath is forbidden for several reasons:

1. Blood oaths are unbreakable; they can only be fulfilled.

2. Similar to Tong Hua's lover's bugs, it requires the willing participation of both individuals to make the oath, often involving the sharing of blood from their fingers. If one person breaks the oath (falls out of love or marries another person), the other person will die of heartbreak (kev tu siab) and longing (kev sib nco).

3. Once a person dies of longing, they can choose to gain heaven's and the afterlife's permission to take the person who broke the oath with them in death by stealing their spirit. More often, they do.

4. If the person who died is not fated for reincarnation, or it's not their time for reincarnation, they will haunt the other person for as many lifetimes as it takes to fulfill the oath, creating an endless cycle of illness and death.

5. The other person can only avoid illness and death when a shaman performs rituals that conceal their spirit from the deceased lover. However, if their spirit is discovered by the dead lover, illness and death are imminent.

6. If they manage to avoid illness and death, the person who broke the oath will live in heartbreak (failing in love and marriage) until they find the person they made the oath to, regardless of how many lifetimes it takes.

In 'Lost You Forever,' I interpreted that XL and XY made a blood oath, binding their spirits for eternity. Even though XY and XL technically didn't consume each other's blood during the lover's bug scene, they symbolically intermixed it on the walnut, which another fellow reader pointed out represents compatibility and companionship in Chinese customs. This act, even if XY made it to ensure CX’s safety, still required her willingness, which serves as proof that she trusts him to protect her heart. Ultimately, XY and XL have pledged their hands in companionship for eternity.

Even if XY lived for 1000 years in a joyful marriage with Jing in her current lifetime, her subsequent lives will still be marked by not only romantic and marital failures but also the burden of illness and premature death until her blood oath to XL is fulfilled. The oath also severs all links to Jing in her next lives. She will never meet him again, and if she does, it will not be a happy reunion.

The blood oath also signifies that while XY may have dedicated her mind and body to Jing, her spirit belongs to XL. For me, a bond made with the spirit is stronger than one made with the body and mind. In Hmong/Miao culture, the spirit is the most vital aspect of existence as it serves as the connection between the past (ancestors) and the present/future (family). Additionally, when a woman marries a man, her spirit comes under the protection of her husband's ancestors. XY's inability to fulfill her oath leaves her spirit homeless, preventing it from returning to her ancestors or entering Jing's lineage. Consequently, she will live in heartbreak and suffer from illness in reincarnation.

Although XY technically fulfills her spoken oath to XL, and XL eliminates the lover's bug with one of his lives, I still believe that she failed to fulfill the unspoken oath of the blood. XL dies on the battlefield while still longing for XY, which becomes a catalyst for a perpetual cycle of longing between them. That's why, even though it's a happy ending for XY in this lifetime (body and mind), she will continue to suffer spiritually, yearning for XL. In her next life and in many lives after for eternity until she finds XL again, she will continue to yearn for him. And that's what makes it all the more heartbreaking for me—“Mam sib ntsib, sib hlub lwm ntiaj.” ('We’ll) meet and love in the next life.

@windia041293

I am in a rush right now, but personally you hit the nail on the head with the bystanders analysis. Though to a degree I would also add Jing as a bystander of YaoLiu. 

I want to ask, what is the second reason why Xiang Liu asked Xiao Yao not to hate him? (Tong Hua responded to a netizen’s question) The first reason is obvious. Everyone knows that she became half-human and half-demon because she had the blood of the demon clan. What is the second reason Tong Hua himself said? What do you think this little fun she calls is?

some say that XL and xy have intimate relations like husband and wife

@AH

The first time I read the description of the last day in 37 years, I felt strange, but I didn’t think about it seriously. Recently, I combined with some discussions on the Internet. Let me briefly describe my point of view.

1. Why can lover's poison save people? Xiang Liu went to Xuanxuan and told him with certainty that he was the only one who could save Xiaoyao, and he relied on the Lover Gu. First of all, Xiang Liu is not someone who takes advantage of others, so he spent a full 37 years (maybe even longer if Jing hadn't been in critical condition), feeding blood to the tip of his tongue, and letting Gu's life continue by continuously releasing love for a long time. In the end, he used it because it was too late. He took the most drastic way - literally awakening Xiao Yao.

2. Why was Xiang Liu so sure that Xiao Yao could be awakened tonight on the last night? It took 37 years before to successfully wake up Xiaoyao, and there was only gradual progress. But after knowing that Jing was in danger - "I'm going to wake you up tonight." Are you so sure? Why? Since it was so certain, why didn't we make a quick decision earlier? I saw someone watching the drama saying that Xiang Liu delayed Xiao Yao for 37 years for his own selfishness - I am too lazy to refute this nonsense, so I just said, 37 years and a vegetative state? Where's the fun? Are you willing to take care of a vegetative person for 37 years?

3. What is the second reason why Xiang Liu asked Xiao Yao not to hate him? (Tong Hua responded to a netizen’s question) The first reason is obvious. Everyone knows that he became half-human and half-demon because he had the blood of the demon clan. What is the second reason Tong Hua himself said? What do you think this little fun she calls is? After comparing the descriptions of Chichen and Aheng's cars, the author's writing habits and psychology can actually correspond.

4. Comparison of the author’s writing habits. Isn’t it obvious here? Very similar, but Yaoliu is much more obscure.

5. Why are sharks mentioned repeatedly? The author repeatedly mentions the sharks in the article. Except for the part about rescuing Jing later, the role of the sharks in the text is to serve as a reference to the relationship between men and women and the relationship between husband and wife. From watching the mating of the sharks, to the seashells, to Xiaoyao's psychological description, to the crystal ball at the back, the content of the sharks runs through Yaoliu's emotional line, and it is a very direct reference to the relationship between men and women.

6. The deep meaning hidden in the chapter title of the article. Unlike today, when everyone casually calls husband and wife, in ancient times, whether it was ancient puppets, fairy tales, or historical dramas, if there was no worship, or no real relationship between husband and wife, the other party would not be regarded as his wife or husband. of. The title of the chapter that Xiaoyao was awakened from is "But the Farewell lasts a long time", which describes a woman's deep yearning for her husband who has traveled far away, and the sadness caused by longing for her return but having no hope of her return. Who is her husband here? Why husband? The title of the last chapter of Sauvignon Blanc is taken from "Leaving a Farewell Wife", which is about a man who is about to go to war and say goodbye to his wife. He will come back when he is born, and he will come back when he dies. If he is alive, he will definitely come back to you. If he dies, I will miss you forever. Who is going to the battlefield here? Xiang Liu. Who is his first wife? Xiaoyao. Jing is married for the second time here, and his first wife is Fangfeng Yiying.

7. A very interesting detail in the drama version - in the previous healing sessions, the shells were always open or half-open. On the last night, the shells were completely closed, which is also interesting.

8. So to sum up, why did Xiang Liu avoid seeing Xiaoyao when she woke up 37 years later? Is there some other reason?

 MySiFeng:

Thank you for the warm welcome!

( ˶⚈Ɛ⚈˵)

 MySiFeng:

I'm OKAY with YSQ tbh. In fact, when I started this show, I did not have any bias. He stood out for me in the first few episodes.

My exact same experience. During the first 3 episodes, I was almost a Jinger. Except for the blushing scene. Dude looked like a 14-year-old. How does one blush at that? Nope.

 MySiFeng:

However, when the scene he disappeared and the Xiaoliu looked so disappointed had me wonder if this guy is going to be reliable in the future.

Yes! His wimpy traits started to become apparent from this moment on.

 MySiFeng:

Then, the whole world came crashing down as he resumed his identity as TSJ. His minor red flags started to show as his responsibilities surfaced and the ultimate scene where he chose to die with XY screamed a BIG RED FLAG.

This. For me, the whole dying thing... I don't know, but it never seemed to be a romantic attitude. More like emotional manipulation. If you die or (if you dare to leave me, in 2023 terms), I have no reason to continue to live. Pathetic.

 MySiFeng:

This guy just doesn't know how to cherish his life, unlike XL who said life is precious. See that?

And others need to keep saving his life for... reasons. I really dislike Xiang Liu for wasting one of his precious lives on that limp fox. Really... wasn't there a better option for XL to "give" to Xiao Yao? Because that Jing dude ain't it. Yikes, meh, pfff *blows a raspberry*

I hope a new war breaks out so XL's atoms and other particles can gather themselves up again and he can do some saving. Ahahahahahahahah