MadelineMaureen

I still haven't finish watching episode 15...They did the one thing that pisses me off as a person. Don't make your villain queer and especially don't make the queerness the reason they are the villain.
This isn't Hays Code days...this trope is used up and they needed to do better. #1 rule in having queer representation...don't make the only queer person the "bad guy". If multiple characters are queer and one so happens to be the bad guy, that is completely different. I'll stop here. The angry rant side of me comes out when thinking about how much I loved the show until that messed up plot device twist.

I would love it if she and Yeo Jin Goo starred in something together as adults. They worked well together as children and I would love to see if they still have good onscreen chemistry together now that they are older. I'm still delulu enough to want the whole younger cast of 'The Moon Embracing the Sun' to do the adult story over again. Kim Soo Hyun was great...but almost(not all) every other "aged up" character was a bit disappointing. Even just a small skit or something...I'll take a damn tiktok meme at this point.

I was watching something recently and everyone was shocked that this one character never turned in some weird twist. Oh it's going to bug me if I can't remember the show/movie.
The the level of mistrust I have with characters that can be described as "affable" or give "good guy", "overly/too helpful" vibes. Unless you are literally paid to help the protagonist like an assistant, I will be watching you like a hawk. Like what do you have to gain from "helping" ML or FL...bombastic side-eye...criminally offensive side-eye.

The real test will come in the next week or two. Normally episodes 1-4 are the ones with the highest production and tightest storytelling. At least that's true on 16 shows aired on a network, as this is a Netflix co-production with SBS the production quality might not take a hit in later episodes. Once it starts getting into the meat of things is when the drama can go sideways(aka VFX are few and far between, sets become used more than location, writing becomes listless). So far episodes 1-4 were solid in all areas. Setting up the suspense with enough mysteries to keep people wanting to comeback for more. Worst case scenario is we have another The King: Eternal Monarch(also a Netflix/SBS co-lab) on our hands and we get sponsors/ads shoved in our faces 5x an episode.

If you are more of a binge-watcher I would hold until Christmas/New Year as there is going to be a two week gap between episode 10 and 11 as this is an SBS show and they host many New Years/Christmas Specials the week of the 29th and 30th. So this could be a good time to catch up without having to deal with too many spoilers.

If you are someone who likes the community discourse/discussion each week more than a one and done, I say go for it. The styling alone makes it nice to look at. They are serving look after look after look. Like it's a damn runway. Also as a large part of the plot is a murder mystery it might be smarter to watch as it airs so you can avoid spoilers more actively.

I hope this helps anyone debating about when to start watching. Sorry for the essay. :)

Oh thank you! I'm not the only one who is looking at Joo Seok Hoon with major side-eye. Also he fits the body type of leather hands dude.
I think he might have a genuine interest in Do Do Hee, but I think he had something to hide within the company and he is the one behind Joo Cheon Sook's murder. I can't tell if he wanted to be the one to marry Do Do Hee because he likes her and wants to protect her. Or if he wants to be closer to her to better hide the truth from her. Or a comb of both.

Can someone correct me if I'm wrong....Joo Seok Hoon is the nephew of the late Chairwoman right?

i feel like chapter 73 & onwards are definitely more AI translated, but better than nothing. & it does have chapters 1-29. im so glad it helped someone. i can at least get the story/plot beats. but those pronouns are all over the place.

I think I just spent an hour trying to find the English translation of this story again after realizing that the OG translator wiped their page(losing chapters 1-29) and then wattpad was like yoink...no more First Frost which had stopped updating at chapter 74ish. So I finally found it again under it's alt name "Hard to Deceive" on MTLNovel.com. Hopefully this helps those of you who are also curious about Sang Yan and YiFan's story.

What I liked about Sang Yan in 'First Frost' was getting to know the character when he is actually trying to impress someone he cares about romantically. The Sang Yan in 'Hidden Love' is from the perspective of a younger sister and best friend. Sang Yan in 'First Frost' is from the perspective of a crush/lover. Same person just different sides of his personality. We only got very small glimpses of the more calculated/cold/standoffish side of Sang Yan in Hidden Love as Yi Fan is kind of the cause of that side of his personality. As the character is VERY secretive in general it makes sense we didn't see that side of him. Can't remember the exact timeline, but I think he lives with Yi Fan for over a year before anyone figures it out. The dude knows how to keep a secret.
Although I think if given the opportunity Victor could do a good job, I agree that the actors listed by White Deer would suit Sang Yan better in First Frost. We need someone who could be the "Icon/Idol/God of Depraved Street".

I know that Lu Si is friends with Victor and there was already a repour there too work with as well with Chen Zhe Yuan. When she was helping to make sure that Hidden Love got made she was calling in lots of favors from friends and businesses she had working relationships with. I just wish that whomever they get to produce and direct this show is as passionate about the project as Lu Si was for Hidden Love. The girl fought tooth and nail to get it right, so I only hope First Frost can receive the same amount of love and care.

If is not apparent by the wall of text above I've been wanting to talk about these two shows/stories with someone for a hot minute. As I think First Frost's English translation was wiped off the internet I really need this show to be made....like yesterday.

Previously it was Zhang Yuxi.

in a country that has a high unemployment rate for people in their 20s & lack of housing etc...the viewers where not down for a "poor little rich girl" storyline. it was a whole lot more than just that but yeah. it's kind of like how some Americans talk about nepo babies.
just to add on i dont agree with the hate she got. but the netizens truly trolled/memed the whole show to filth.

not the writer, but the production team. when viewers started praising the actor more than the ML on social networks they cut his character's scenes down drastically.

because the 2ML(brother)'s actor was becoming more popular & viewers were shipping him with the FL, the production cut A LOT of his scenes down...A LOT. Let's jst say YY should have definitely stayed away from social networks during the airing of this show.

oh...so many reasons. The tea was freaking hilarious in real time. Cnetizens memed the HELL out of this show. The actor who plays the 2ML was more popular so the show writers/editors CUT HIS SCENES which obviously pissed off the fans. With YY's typical acting level not meeting the standard the viewers wanted. (lets all me honest, when he is too aware of himself it looks like he has a pole up his ass.) With China's economy & the current issues 20 somethings are dealing with EVERYTHING that was a hardship for the FL was met with...so what you're rich now...suck it up. You're wasting resources in this economy for a water fight!? level comments.
And the cherry on top was the fact the government had to make multiple statements about proper use and safety of fire extinguishers as well as some other PSAs throughout the airing. It was an entire shit show on weibo. If you can find the English translation videos on youtube about everything that happened...worth it alone to search.

thank you. she mentioned aunt-in-law & her uncle many times in this episode to the FL so i was extremely confused. It must have just been teasing. aka "you're going on a blind date? what about my uncle?" i was interpretating it as the niece knowing about their relationship, not her try to play matchmaker.

i need some help. Im on episode 19 & must have had a long blink during a previous episode...
When did the FL and the real niece figure out each other's connection to the ML?
Did i skip a scene?

I never even started season 2 of Love Alarm because I was over the woah is me attitude of every character. That whole show was depressing af.
With Namsoon, I kept hoping that they would swing back to Namsoon and her relationship with Hee Shik, and develop their relationship more, but they never really did. We had more in-depth scenes with the homeless couple than we ever got with what was supposed to be the FL and ML.
They never fully showed her being uncomfortable with the "villain" and contrasted it well enough with how comfortable she is with the "ML". They didn't want her to come off as manipulative while UNDERCOVER so it always came across as genuine interest/concern when it came to her relationship to her boss...who was actively and gleefully killing people.
They had such serious subject matter only to not give it the proper weight it deserved in the story. The homeless couple was pointless. She could have met a singular female homeless person who was kind to her to be able to further that part of the story. The acting thing went nowhere. It was a waste of airtime. The uncle was also a waste of could have been funny, but just became absolutely pathetic, and again went NO WHERE. The brother's plot was necessary and worked well, but we never got to see her bond with her TWIN.

So what those two shows have in common is lack of clarity on feelings. But Namsoon is the bigger offender because it was billed as a romcom....very little Rom from the titular character.

i thought that was was said, but wasnt 100%. thank you for answering my question! 🥰

also to add on for those curious.

Hair down & braided for women means unmarried/young, for men they put their hair in a top knot when they come of age, typically around the age of 15.
At that time, Joseon Era, Neo-Confucianism was taught & practiced so cutting one's hair would be considered extremely disrespectful to one's parents, as you hair is a gift from your parents.
Only monks would shave their heads completely.

Noble men and commoners wore gat(갓) traditional hats both outside & inside their homes.

Samo, are worn by government officals(the more solid one with little wings on the back, thimble looking ones).
Jeongjawan, are worn at home & by teachers. (they are the ones that look like architecture for the head, pointy and big). The more intricate the more wealth or status that person has.
Military/police/soldiers etc. officials wear a Junlip, the sturdy felt-like hats with feathers & beads. Kind of look like a symbol.
A Paeraengi, is made of reeds, bamboo or arrowroot & would be worn by commoners.

When woman married they tied up their hair. There is a great breakdown on thetalkingcupboard website "A Guide to Joseon Hairstyles & Headgears" highly recommend.
These hairs styles alone are a shorthand for class, status, and age etc. So if you plan to continue watching "historical" Korean shows it might be fun for you to investigate more. (I went down a whole ADHD hole a few years ago on this topic)

Also something that is sometimes a plot line in historical shows are the embroidery on the government officals tunics. There are certain animals that are only for royalty. The number of crains can indicate rank/position. It is such a detailed an nuanced thing...shot out to all the wardrobe & costume designers for keeping track.

nothing is as bad as LL Cool J "speaking" Korean in NCIS LA....I wanted to crawl inside my own body & no longer exist.

i was having a lot of fun at first but with the way they have the FL separated from the ML AND her family for the majority of the episodes it just isnt vibing right for me. hopefully the final 4 episodes will have more interactions, but 🤷‍♀️.