Nepeta 22

How comes I can't find this on Iqiyi even with that name?

Thanks for the link. I have since found out they had split season 4 so this all makes sense.

I didn't know all the background of Thirteen Hongs of Canton, but feel a little sad if what you wrote is true. Nevermind, let's hope it will be released soon. Anyway, hope you enjoy this drama!

One of the most popular dramas this year was This Thriving Land. This drama was mainly aimed for the domestic market and ironically if more promotion was put on it to international audiences, I believe a lot of people will really like its depiction, especially showing China's past and reforms, old traditions of farming villages and most importantly how balanced it was in depicting internal war between KMT and the communists.

In fact, one of the characters dropped everything for the communists and cause so much strive and pain that left a big negative print in the family. I would say, more dramas like this needs to be shown, and maybe after the success, the public yearn for more normal life with less politics from 1900 to 1980s. I understand that there were big political changes at that time, but it's better they can sometime be very small side plots. That may make these dramas appeal more.

OK, thanks for taking the time to compare the themes on both dramas. I do hope one day that drama makes it out.

One of my top dramas although a very hard watch was the recently controversially held back A Love Never Lost. I would say, it more or less covered history with real names on certain characters. Many of the actors had huge lines in Japanese language and 1/4 of drama was set in Japan.

The updated version (after being stopped for about a year or so) did give a romantic view of Japan and those that resided in China at the time. The forefathers for future Communist party characters were painted as chauvinistic, narcistic, womanizing and had no respect for females at the time.

I would say, I was not expecting to see that portrayal, but I am glad they did and it made the drama ever more realistic without any kind of heavy handed slant to paint the early pioneers of the communists as saints. In fact, they were shown as terrorists and hypocritical when it came to money.

OK, thanks for clearing that up. I will just take it that getting a drama through for the Qing Dynasty era, it's sensitive and how the story is portrayed needs careful consideration in regards to lifestyle and how royalty are portrayed.

As for the link, we will just have to ironically say, some may take that as a pinch of salt considering where it was published 😉.

In regards to the two endings, it is up to you how you interpret it, but the first ending was probably the real ending. But that kind of ending would have been a downer as she'd probably get life imprisonment for this type of crime. The alternate ending means he gets his justice and she gets justice without harming her own life.

The sentencing part is always going to be there to pass censorship because this drama is set in modern day time and deals with crimes that needs to end with sentencing. But it offers an in depth look at difficult subjects such as what constitutes as self defence, manipulation and possible abuse of the system.

I agree that some parts of the sentencing have may have gone a bit over-board but rumour mongering is currently a big issue in China and they are going through many changes to ensure those online act responsibly and defamation particularly of stars or public figures have seen some high profile examples where some charges have been actioned.

It's great to hear that you are pushed to learn the language. I am not as motivated as you though...I'm also surprised too with that drama not getting subbed, because there was a big effort internationally to have that subbed but to-date, still it's not subbed. Oh well.

On the other hand, we can't complain. After all China is not trying to court the international audience. Their stance is, if you want to watch you learn our language. I think that line is perfectly fine since for too long those that know or speak English simply expect everyone around the world to adopt their language whatever reason. But in domestic dramas, I think this is not a priority.

I know, it took me twice as long and in the older dramas, they are upwards of 50 episodes! But, I wanted to watch a drama depicting the time just before CPC won the civil war. I haven't done many like this since, so not ideal, but obviously a bit desperate. Nowadays, many dramas are subbed luckily.

Someone on here earlier said they thought Qing Dynasty dramas are banned and got a result of someone saying only ones showing lavish lifestyle? Is this why dramas like The Thirteen Hongs is just left to rot? I believe that drama has been made a long time ago and there has been no further updates. There was only a trailer.

I am a bit upset that this drama is coming out with a similar theme. Why? Anyone know anything? I'm not a fan of Chen Xiao's acting or Sun Qian's acting, but am interested in the theme.

What I tend to do is I try to watch the episode without subtitles. Then I go over to Baike Baidu page and then auto translate to English and read the episode guides. There I find out if I have missed anything. I did this on the whole of Fearless Whispers drama. That's another option.

I agree, and I do mention this from time to time on other forums, but it's a bit of a sore subject and can be difficult to discuss since it can touch on all of us to some extent, but it does need exploring and discussion when I often see only FL or female characters are targeted but seldom male characters. That is not really by accident...

So far I haven't had anyone making trouble, but normally I get no response which is fine too since it can cause friction and negativity.

I hope to see drama makers moving away from doing so much fan service and taking too much notice on some sections of fandoms simply there for their basic fantasies. It can take away true drama making, story telling and of course coherent storylines that make sense rather than feed basic fantasies.

Whilst it might be true that some male actors may do this but in this case, I would hardly call this a female centric ip to begin with and I think the highlights here do not veer wildly to the source novel. I heard the author has already hinted the ML's character was even more cruel in the novel and the FL lead was like a doormat and pining after him. I would think to get this acceptable, they'd have to dial down his cruelty and make the FL more independent and not mindlessly chasing him.

Try telling that to some of these toxic viewers. Some are so brainwashed by the editing, they'd rather lust after a cruel and cunning ML because they are not actually watching the drama, but simply inserting themselves there like some kind of fetish to be punished.

I think to some extent a fair few viewers here fall into that category but they are unaware of it. This is why BL is big, because it simply takes away the "FL problem" and simply goes full-on lust for the men. This is also why FLs become easy targets most of the time, even when the ML is domineering, abusing their position and being manipulative. All dodgy traits in real-life, but in a drama setting, they want a male character to be like that so they can be the only one that can tame him. Such low grade fantasy.

Ooh, interesting. That is indeed some spoiler! Thanks for the heads-up on that. I may dip in soon. I hope you enjoy the rest of the drama. Let's hope the drama is not outside of the actual drama!

Yes the topic of how male and female characters are written or directed is complex and it always interest me in how writers try to depict each other. Sadly as you say, the issue is a worldwide one and not just specific to China. But, I think it's slowly changing. Sometimes, original scripts seem to be more dynamic and on the ball than some of these older novels that tend to be more fetishes as you say. Hope you enjoy the rest of the drama. See you around...

Totally agree with your comments there. For now, I have nothing more to add other than hope there will be a change. A turning point for story writing where there is balance and less of the learned behaviour from decades of brainwashing from the men's narrative, that even female novelists fall into the trap of writing ML characters as cruel, domineering and manipulative and trying to then re-spin it as uncontrollable love that is only reserved for one female. (childish fantasy that should stay only in a book for select target audience) and she has to endure it because he's so in love he can't contain himself so he may do cruel things along the way to protect and cherish her.

Even writing this, I start to cringe! Some of these novelists are just low-brow smutty fantasists. They then complain when they see their novel being cleaned up for the general public, but totally unaware of how their novel looks like to a passerby. Anyway, enjoy the drama. I will see if I pick it up soon.

Yes I heard. I have no respect for some of these so-called novel writers. Happy to lap up the glory when things go their way, but quick to abandon ship when the going gets tough. They'd rather shift the blame anywhere but face criticism.

I heard that the original story was so bad that it had to be changed for it to be accepted to be ready for a 2020 audience. FL was more or less a doormat and more or less allowed the ML to take advantage of her.

I heard that author apparently even complained that the ML adaptation was too weak and not cruel enough. She may be in her own little fantasy of having men dominance, but she needs to know when this type of story is adapted it needs to be modified.

Some of these novelists are just mere smutty writers writing their own fantasies of how they want men to dominate them. That's my honest opinion. Therefore, I am not at all surprised at this low-brow behaviour.

I'm afraid I only watched 1 episode and cannot continue due to my dislike of actor Wang Zhuo Cheng. Knowing he figures heavily in this drama, I am undecided. I don't think it's right for me to pin anything up in discussions.

The issue with many historic romance dramas are trying to balance the customs of that time and trying to merge it with modern day standards. Many novels try to make forced or arrange marriages work by labelling them as enemies to lovers, but many of the storylines use ML characters as a tragic victim to make it more palatable to the modern viewers. I can see this opens up a can of worms where FLs are then written more like difficult or challenging personalities to uplift the ML's dominance. It's a shame.

But I think it's quite heinous when FL's character is honest, open and never has an ulterior motive, she's then labelled as stupid or dumb! These are good traits the last I checked...Some viewers cannot put down their own prejudices and just clear their heads to watch a drama. It is what it is.

She watched 1 episode and decided no more. That's her choice and I respect that. She has her own standards with story telling and camera work. I too only watched 1 episode and decided to not watch. But for a different reason. I don't like Wang Zhuo Cheng's acting or his dememour. Knowing what is ahead, I cannot stomach a whole drama seeing his acting.

But what I find more disturbing is the constant mindless attacks on the FL. It's clear she's too pure and innocent for them. If that is so, why still watch and continue to attack? This is the story. There is nothing wrong with being idealistic and innocent when male lead characters play them, but tons of hatred when a female is like that? Moreover, she's labelled as stupid. I fear some viewers' bitterness in real life have influenced and infiltrated their viewing experience. They cannot watch with a clear head. That baggage needs clearing out before they can fully immerse themselves into any drama.

A voice of reason, but you will not see much reaction to this because most that shout the loudest are often unable to admit nor even see they're watching with a bias already but most often unable to know that they're brainwashed by the filter that often spins the line of toxic behaviour hidden under the guise of obsessive love. A very dangerous line that glamourise deception and re-selling it into pure love. But no, they go after the easy target because they think she should wise up because they think so without even dissecting the story rather putting their own bias and filter into it.

It's all too common on these forums. In A Dream Within A Dream, we get to see it in full swing. And the funny thing is the ending right up to the last minutes were a slap back at those that had made all those comments. It will be silent for those that made similar comments to the ones here.

Being given an all-seeing-eye, some viewers fall into the trap of constantly expecting the characters to do exactly what they want with the knowledge, conveniently ignoring the character doesn't have that luxury. It's fine to show frustration from time to time, but when it descends into threats of violence to FL with name calling her as I have seen words like bitch & ripping her hair out. That should be called out. Those that do that really ought to look inside themselves for actually venting that way. Would they do this in real life?