lilili

The ending is seen in the very first scene of the very first episode. Thyme and Gorya meet in the stadium and Thyme narrates how she's changed his life in a voiceover. It's a future scene and then we see everything that leads up to that moment. I think we will end up back there in the last episode of the series.

The main problem is they are stuck with the Hana Yori Dango plot. They did so much to update and make it better but this part of the story is a complete mess in every version. I was hoping F4T would beat the curse but nope.

"the entire theme is for coming to age ceremony rather than romance" <<< This and that's why I'm fine with the lack of a kiss. There is so much going on here with the characters growing up and yes, physical intimacy will be part of that, but the main point in this version isn't the love story but how all the characters grow and change for the better. That's why I'm attached to Thyme and Gorya as individuals, not just as part of the ship, and why I'm attached to each of the F4 as individuals, not just a blob that follows the main couple around.

I've seen every drama version except for MG 2018 (dropped after 2 eps). I just completely disagree with what you're saying (and no I don't think the drama is perfect, I didn't particularly like how ep 11 was executed). The supporting characters get less screen time because the drama is shorter but they are far more complex than in other versions. The writing is so tight that even minor characters like Tia and Glakao get more and more interesting development.

I wrote a long comment about it below. I know most people love the episode but for me the flashback to Talay and Phupha went on too long.

I think all of the F4 characters are much more fleshed out in F4T than in any other version. This is separate from whether any of them get a romance (and fwiw the K&K characters are not end game in any version except for BoF).

You have Ren who is so different from Rui, Lei and Ji Hoo that it's almost like a new character. He's complex, he doesn't do things in obvious ways (provoking Thyme into a fight to admit he loves Gorya, taking Gorya on a date to test her feelings for Thyme). He's evolved from a person who only cares about Mira to the biggest champion for Thyme and Gorya.

Kavin is complex too. He's the most power conscious of the F4, the most likely to use the levers of power in his favor (valedictorian because his uncle in the education minister). But he also in some ways is the most respectful/least paternalistic when it comes to Gorya and Kaning. He tries to tutor Gorya at the funeral, he gives Kaning the precious flower patterns that belong to his grandmother. As a person who wields and understands power, he's affirming that Gorya and Kaning are powerful too.

MJ is the heart of the F4, the one who calls out poor behavior like Thyme's red card to Gorya and the kidnapping. He's also the most invested emotionally in the friendships and works to keep everyone together. In other versions the fourth lead just smirks in the background.

The show did all this while grappling with shoveling plot into 16 eps that takes a minimum of 18 eps in other versions. Amazing.

I think I would've been more invested in Talay's redemption if we'd formed some kind of real attachment to him in the three (!!!) episodes he appeared in before ep 11. By contrast, we had seen Phupha getting victimized by Thyme so many times over the course of the series through flashbacks that when we see what happened to him it lands heavily because it feels like already know him in a certain sense.

I did think the Phupha and Talay actors had great chemistry to the point where I kept thinking they should've gone the BL route with them.

It only got cut short when it aired on GMM tv. You got the full scene if you watched it on YouTube or Viu.

Despite my problems with Ep 11 giving that line to Talay was freakin' brilliant. Reminds me of giving the good shoes take you good places line to Gorya's father.

I understand what you're saying but they are also limited by the plot. They've changed so much but at the end of the day it's a Hana Yori Dango adaptation. This story is hugely problematic and there's no way to completely deproblematize it because what it's really about is women's sexual desire in the face of a potentially annihilating patriarchy. I think considering the source material they've done a phenomenal job. But I also completely understand people who are screw that story, let it die.

I was much more invested in Phupha because we saw him suffer in ep 1 and then there are a lot of flashbacks to that cruelty so seeing how it affected him really hit hard. I agree it would've been way more powerful to see him speaking with Thyme. That's what I mean, the show made us care about Phupha organically while we were being forced to care about Talay.

I'm in the minority on this episode. A lot of people loved it. Also, even with my critique there were parts of the episode that were legitimately powerful. For example, Thyme raised his fist with Gorya in ep 7 when he was jealous and then we get the flashback to him raising his fist with Talay and lowering his fist even after getting slapped in the face. That was amazing callback. And I got legit choked up when Thyme hit send on the social post and when he fell to his knees to ask for forgiveness. Like I said, this episode absolutely had to happen. But the writing just wasn't on the very high level set in some other episodes. (eps 7 and 9 are my favorites).

I'm thinking more about #F4ThailandEp11 and have to say I don't think the writing is as strong as we've seen in previous episodes. The biggest issue I had was with how they handled Talay's character and his relationship with Phupha.

We're introduced to Talay back in episode 8 when he helps Gorya negotiate a better price to clean Tia's dress. Then he periodically shows up in eps 9 and 10 but the writers deliberately keep him as a mysterious figure and I think that was a mistake.

Those early episodes were an opportunity for us to view Talay sympathetically and develop an emotional attachment to him. That would've set up the big reveal so we as viewers would've been as shocked as Gorya. It also would've gotten us more invested in his character arc.

Instead, the writers spent a huge chunk of ep 11 with Talay expositing his entire relationship with Phupha. It was supposed to make us more sympathetic to Talay but instead I felt frustrated spending so much time with a character I didn't already care about.

The scenes that worked for me in ep 11 all involved Thyme and to a lesser extent Gorya (oh and our fave K&K couple). Thyme saying if he fights back he loses was a powerful moment! So was seeing him on his knees. And of course him giving Gorya the meteor necklace was amazing.

These are the same complaints I had about Hana's episode, fwiw. Her monologue was too long and on the nose, if that makes any sense. The series has so much subtle and metaphoric writing (see my fave ep 9 & the billionaire's funeral) that I'm let down when we get a lecture.

Having said that, both the Hana & Talay episodes were hugely important to the themes of the series and to Thyme's redemption arc. The atonement absolutely had to happen. I just wish the execution had been better.

I get why people are upset that Thyme didn't face more severe consequences in this episode but folks, it's a Hana Yori Dango adaptation and it went sooooooo much farther than any other version in calling out the ML's violence and having him accept responsibility. If you can't with this episode then the entire franchise is just not for you.

I think the advice other people are giving you is probably correct and you should skip this. But for another perspective, I know two people who hated Boys Over Flowers with a white hot passion because of how abusive it is and they are enjoying the Thai version. Have all the toxic elements been removed? No, but the drama is doing a great job of contextualizing the toxic behavior and calling it out in within the narrative. It is also grappling with bullying as a social phenomenon (why the school's students are eager to participate in the bullying) and abuse of power among the wealthiest people in the country (there's an incredible 20 minute sequence at a billionaire's funeral that doesn't exist in the other versions). The writing and visual storytelling are complex and not what you'd expect to see in a teen drama. It's definitely flawed but in my opinion well worth watching.

If you do watch, I recommend you skip part one of episode 7, that is the most difficult to watch because of abusive behavior.

This is also a personal aside: women engage with problematic narratives for all kinds of complex reasons and people loving the franchise shouldn't be interpreted as them wanting to be abused or not recognizing abusive relationships in real life. At heart, this story is about women grappling with desiring men in the context of a dangerous patriarchy which is why it still holds power after 30 years.

Girl From Nowhere on Netflix was recommended to me (I haven't seen it but it looks good). One of the writers is also writing for F4 Thailand. https://www.netflix.com/watch/80241859?trackId=14170286

This is an incredible FMV of Thyme and Gorya's relationship that leans hard into how dark it is. I love it. https://twitter.com/EmmaB_Videos/status/1499217144227192832

I thought Nani wasn't getting a song! Excellent news.

Thyme is the black rose (and his mother's name is Roselyn which is fascinating). Kavin is hydrangea. I don't know Ren's flower and I can't ID it based on the episode opening but it's white and sort of looks like a daisy.

"So, to be fair, if you’re expecting a tropey romcom teen drama with a bit of angst, this could all be a bit weird and confusing." <<< YES THIS. But one thing that's been incredibly gratifying is how many people I see who are getting and appreciating the story that's being told. I find it very moving that the storytellers trusted us enough to get it.