Novel Fans and Donghua Fans Sanctuary

 OniBro:

"Did he really need to add that? Change that? and this and that and this? What problem was there? Was it not engaging enough or what?"

Lol and the answer to all of the above is NO. Ugh, like Singularity mentioned, none of the Titled Douluos are intimidating at all. 99% of the characters are caricatures of themselves and the only resemblance they share with the actual characters are the names. I mean, I guess this is something only novel/manhua/donghua fans would notice but when the drama is watched by something like 60-70% males who are tuning in because it's DOULUO DALU, then it's a huge fail. IMO, one of the first things a drama writer needs to know is the audience they are writing for and write for them, which Wang Juan did not manage with this adaptation. 

 apocalib:

IMO, one of the first things a drama writer needs to know is the audience they are writing for and write for them, which Wang Juan did not manage with this adaptation. 

And that is exactly why I find it is so ironic that he has the title of "The Industry's Conscience." He applied his formula to the wrong genre, story, and audience. It's just an IP that's out of his element and expertise. Which is why I mentioned that from what I've seen at least, I would've trusted this with the King's Avatar writers because of how much they tried to explain game mechanics and the importance of tactics with teamwork in there.

I don't think the big twist in JoL was why it succeeded though, maybe WJ took the wrong lesson from the success? The entire drama was interlinked mysteries and suspense, one problem solved and the next began. The reveal at the end did surprise me and re-contextualized the show but that wasn't why I liked the drama, that was just dessert, there'd already been 40 solid episodes beforehand. You can't just have 1 big surprise be the only pay off for a drama, idc how major it is.

Obviously you can't adapt a novel that has almost no surprises (Qian Renxue identity fuckery literally only thing that surprised me) in the same you adapt a novel that's built on surprises but I guess that's what he tried to do.

I feel like maybe I like DC better then most people is this thread though, I do like the shrek seven devils team dynamics and interactions, they're really fun and cute but yeah in general it all feels kind of uninspired and meh.

 Shrimpy:

King's Avatar followed the novel, I have read it. Now whoever wrote that script knows how to respect the original. 

To screenwriters that actually follow and respect the original:

I've just finished today's episodes and heaved the biggest sigh of disappointment. They're cramming too much plot into the last few episodes. Now, I can understand wanting to write some plot into the tournament arc since basically all they do is fight but the plot doesn't make sense! (Side note, Sword Gramps got knocked on his ass by some mysterious~ black figure that's YZQ btw but I lol bc Sword Gramps?? REALLY?!?!). 

Either way, I think the biggest problem with this drama, and I say this not bc of all the adaptation issues, but as a general cdrama watcher, is that I'm not connecting with the characters nor am I invested in the story. I'm sure there are plenty that will say they love the drama and that's their right, but the original story's allure is missing here. My cousin, who is a pretty easy-going XZ stan and not into wuxia/xianxia like I am, told me she got really bored by ep10 and started skipping a lot of parts. I don't dislike this drama to the extent that I'd tell folks not to watch bc perhaps they might find it interesting but it's a disappointment and def did not meet my expectations. 

I'm also doubtful XZ will sign on as it's a long process to film and there's plenty of other dramas in the pond. Besides, I don't think this is the type of drama he needs to be going after anymore since he is already well-known and wants to go towards a more "serious actor" route vs "idol actor". I know XZ has an extremely good relationship with Tencent but they've got other IPs they're adapting that XZ is rumored for soooooo.....

 Singularity:

I don't think the big twist in JoL was why it succeeded though

Definitely I think the big twist in JoL's last episode was not the reason it succeeded. Leading up to that we had:

* the viewers were allowed to ruminate over 'life' moments. Eg the scene where Fan Xian says goodbye to the grandmother ... how the scene lingered on the grandmother's actions/expressions, the music that accompanied it. Another example is when Fan Xian reads the plaque his mother left behind and so gets to have a sense of her thoughts and aspiratiosn, of the person she was. There was a number of these moments throughout that series;

* the viewers got the pleasure/satisfaction payoff of having Fan Xian use his boss mode cheat of having already lived once. The prime example being demolishing his petty opponents in those poetry slams;

* the fantasy elements of the time shift and mixing the knowledge/technology of the previous civilization with the latter devolved one.

Fantasy elements, emotional payoffs and smiting your enemies with a hidden cheat mode.

How could that not have worked?

It would've taken a real dumbass to f*ck that up.

(Wait a minute ... need to pause a moment to reflect on how those last few sentences apply to this series ...)

The JoL series lead me to reading the novel. I have to say the most fun parts of Fan Xian's story were his early years. The novel got increasingly boring as he aged. I'm thinking in season 2 how they choose to pace the continuing story of his life, what moment they choose to be the peak/finale, how they choose to continue working the time shift fantasy elements into it, all these things are going to be crucial to the series success. 

Well ... duh, I suppose ... all of that probably didn't need to be said ... but my point is I hope they don't follow the novel to the 'T' in those aspects, because the novel really dragged on as it got older.

One thing I do hope is that they change the crux of the Temple's story. The end to that arc in the novel was a major letdown for me. Very anti-climatic.

I can totally see Yan Bingan's twist betrayal of Fan Xian as actually being something that might not actually be betrayal ... but if I said anything further I might be spoiling the novel for people who haven't read it.

==================

The parallel between 'Joy of Life' and 'Douluo Dalu' is, of course, their second life boss cheats.

... ...

I wonder why it is this kind of story element seems so prevalent in the majority of fantasy type stories in the translated novels I end up reading. Do people feel so powerless living their modern lives they'd like to have an already lived life to guide their actions?

... meh, anyways...

In JoL the second life aspect made a kind of sense to me as a reader. And because it 'fit' in the story, I could view Fan Xian as a very shameless character, going around using other people's accomplishments in the previous civilization to advance his own prospects in the current one. 

In DD Tang San's second life never really 'fit' for me (on an emotional level, not an intellectual one), which is why I'm not unhappy they dropped it from the series.

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 Singularity:

I think that maybe Wang Juan should stick with political/mystery stories and not cultivation stories.

*Disclaimer: this next bit is just my point of view. If you think it's insulting, please look past the insult and focus on the content*

Let's face it. Straightforward cultivation stories are simplistic, and because of that simplicity, bland and ultimately boring.

>Be underleveled and so likely to lose against your opponents.

>Level up using either training or some specially gained 'skill'.

>Win against your opponents.

>Rinse, repeat.

What makes so-called cultivation stories work are the added emotional payoffs and side stories of politics, mystery, fantasy, whatever.

An evil opponent wants to kill your weak arse because (insert whatever emotional/political/mysterious/fantastical story element here). Level up, become stronger, beat your evil opponent, get that emotional payoff of being superior.

Those political/mystery elements you're deriding serve as the story backbone for the reason to cultivate.

====================

 OniBro:

Wang Juan's bio here

Side note : when a person's own bio declares themselves to be famous, personally I think that's a bit problematic. ^^

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 apocalib:

Nothing against Oscar's actor because I actually like him (and Oscar) but it's probably a two notches too high on the cringe scale to be funny.

+1

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 apocalib:

To be really blunt and honest, he just failed at adapting Douluo.

I'm going to respectfully disagree with you guys on this. I think we need to wait until the completion of the series to see how his altered plot lines work out in full. It's too early to tell.

I agree the alterations are somewhat unsettling for those of us who have read, and become used to, the original story. However sometimes alterations to the original can be good. I don't think we can really judge without seeing the whole picture.

Can't see the forest for the trees, etcetera etcetera.

 Xien_Rue:

Regarding The King Avatar, it was a good adaptation. The drama change and addition were enriching the story instead of destroying it. Now that is a drama that deserve season 2. Not this one.

Eeeh. 

I admit, I loved the first season, and am very much wanting to see the second because they did it so well.

However ....

A lot of the relationship development, the depiction of the 'romance' in online play, was in the first half of the book leading up to their challenger league win. The second half, which was primarily focussed on their path through the pro season, got boring because it wasn't really much more than that.

I'm cautiously looking forward to the second season because the first season was done so well, but am also a little terrified the second season, if it strictly follows the book, might be a let down as the second half of the book was. I'm very much hoping they can work their dramatic arts fingertips to the bone to make the second season just as addictive as the first.

That said:

(1) I really missed the Unrivalled Super Hottie arc from novel. I know it's probably too late since the Cleric has already been adopted into the team but I'm hoping they can work it in.

(2) I loved the character of Fang Rui in the novel. Can't wait to see what he's like in the series.

@Shrimpy - who made you god?

This is an open forum, last I knew.

And this thread, as I understood it, was for people who had already read or watched previous material of this IP to discuss it openly without ruining the mood of first time viewers. 

Now all of a sudden a person is only welcome if they're bitter about it?

Funny, that you would criticize WJ's fanbase as being mindless drones, but can't take a person expressing an opinion you find disagreeable.

The thread is named "novel fans and donghua fans sanctuary" not "let's all be negative here".

I expressed my thoughts on this and related IPs mentioned (I believe) in a respectful manner. I didn't tell you to shut up and go away (as you did).

I didn't say you were unable to make up your own mind.

I didn't say you needed my permission.

I don't believe I laid out any conditions you had to satisfy.

I simply and respectfully disagreed on one or two points.

Why don't you have some decency to learn how to deal with people who have points of view that differ from your own.

Toughen up you precious little petal.