Tushan Jing and Xiao Yao, here's to a Happily Ever After

@AH

The term 知己 (zhiji) has created difficulties for translating and fully understanding a number of historical C Dramas, and some really insightful posts have been made on the topic.

I have very little knowledge about Chinese. Almost none. So its difficult. But with context from chapter 19.. the translation of "soulmate" is definetly out of place. 

Chapter 19: 

Xiao Yao gaped at him “You….don’t stuff yourself silly.”

Bei shot her a look and she immediately shut up.

Bei ate the final bite and put down his chopstick. He took a sip of wine and casually said “Not bad.”

Xiao Yao stared at the empty plate and her heart soared “The only person who can make poisons this tasty in the entire world is me!”

Bei laughed back “And the only person in the entire world who can appreciate your great “cooking” talents is me!”

Xiao Yao sassed back “It’s enough to have a true soulmate.”

Bei gave her a half-smile but said nothing.

I mean....its true that poison food is only shared between, one is maker and the other have it. But they aren't in any commitment relationship. Both of them know. Besides she was already sort of commit to the other guy. XL/FFB knew it too. So it's not natural for her to say the word "soulmate". Although if we really research about soulmate, it's not neccessarily a romantic partner. But  then it's not something many think when they saw the word "soulmate". So that translation is misleading. 

By the in case it's interesting in Thai version.. 

It is translation : "Having only one who knows the value is enough!"

"มีผู้รู้ค่าคนเดียวก็พอแล้ว"

it's from chapter 19 the 3rd vol of Thai ver because Thai 6 books in total. 

but the drama version having as  "true friend " is fine i guess.

 peng-peng:

AH



By Thai version I meant  the official thai  novel of  lyf.

Oh that makes sense. I've heard fans mention the official translation of the novel into Vietnamese a lot, but I forgot that there's also an official translation of the novel into Thai. 

 peng-peng:

True friend ship is not always platonic though .

That's a good point. I always consider it a green flag when someone describes their romantic partner as their best friend. 

 peng-peng:

Unfortunately  the Chinese speaker who did translate lyf is koala  lol.

I would be over the moon if a really good, professional translation for then novel into English ever came out. Until then, I'm grateful to be able to access Koala's translation, even if it isn't perfect.

 peng-peng:

Any way we agree that soul mate is not the right translation in this case. 

Yep.

Part 4

The Chess Play

The chess play scene was humorous and fun. But it also tells about the characters well. The romantic attraction between Wen Xao Liu and Ye Shi Qi is presented with words Shi Qi's heart beat and Wen Xiao Liu's heart leapt. Zhaun Xu's reaction towards Xiao Liu is still that of a big brother who got annoyed at his little sister naughty act. He was all disappointed when Xiao Liu wanted to play chess when Shi Qi had agree. 

The way Shi Qi taught Xiao Liu to play chess is not like he is all after what she want. But he was seriously teaching her even if it isn't the interest of Wen Xiao Liu. The action tells Shi Qi aka Jing character of being patient and also caring towards Xiao Liu but also serious with what they are actually doing.

Farewell & Maintaining Promise 

It is now a time for Shi Qi to back to Tushan Clan to clear things off. 

15 years promised is spoken again. He asked her again to give him time and locked the heart. It was clear Xiao Liu agreed to this promise because she longed for him too, because she could not severed. 

We can clearly Shi Qi was in love with her just like any decent or ordinary man would be in love. The only fact is he is not letting go. He was in love with her even before he could see her true female. Their male female attraction is just very pure raw. I mean Xiao Liu attraction to Shi Qi was when he was still in bandage. And Shi Qi attraction to Xiao Liu was when she was still in false form.
Regardless of their appearances, their hearts beat. 

The promise is just a promise because there is no gurantee that it could be definetly fulfilled. Whether it would disappear or become a woven web, nobody just know yet.

https://mydramalist.com/discussions/lost-you-forever-season-2/122339-tong-hua-s-xiaojing-drama-novel-exploration-x1f49c?pid=2936513&page=10#p2936513

Part 5

Xiao Yao & Zhuan Xu

Xiao Yao's Fear Inside
It's only finally when Xiao Yao and Zhuan Xu were together alone that she was able to reveal her true fear inside. She feared always that she might be the bastard child and her mother might be adulterous. And she scared it might be true. But Zhuan Xu comforted it wasn't. 

Zhuan Xu's Wrecked Feelings On Parents'Love

In my opinion, Zhuan Xu's mother suicide to be his dad, leaving him, must have impact on Zhuan Xu take on love and marriages. I think he always thought his mother must be so irresponsibility and such love must be a absurd.

Grand Emperor Teaching Of Politics&Wars
According to how Zhuan Xu describe on Grand Emperor, as an Emperor, indeed he has to be ruthless and taught Zhuan Xu like he was his own even to kill off the guards whom had been appointed to Zhuan Xu when the guards were not only listening Zhuan Xu's order. It was really strict and also a bit of ruthless. However, when managing army and running a nation, those ruthless acts must be involved. 

Zhuan Xu's Depending On Xiao Yao
Zhuan Xu was very frank about how he needed Xiao Yao in his journey to conquer throne. He was so sure about their strong bond, comfort in each other. With Xiao Yao already using her life to protect him. With Xiao Yao, he craved to depend on her. 

Promise To Protect Each Other
Their promise to protect each other started since they were kids they vow to protect each other in front of their grandmother and mothers.  Again this promise is now revoked. 

https://mydramalist.com/discussions/lost-you-forever-season-2/122339-tong-hua-s-xiaojing-drama-novel-exploration-x1f49c?pid=2937163&page=10#p2937163

Wrap Up

In this chapter, the promise and bond between Xiao Yao and Zhuan Xu is shown. It revoked as Zhuan Xu admitted he will need Xiao Yao in jounrnet his goal both in emotion and her power. The chapter also showed Xiao Yao was attached to Grand Emperor as her father and her fear was that she was not, and also concerned about her mother's actions. And Zhuan Xu loathe how his parents died together, leaving him alone. A Nian, Gao Xing Yi ....Yi has a meaning of "missing". So A Nian may be presented a substitute for Xiao Yao to both Grand Emperor and Zhuan Xu. With the old promise coming back, another new promise was maintained too. Despite having ties to his family, Jing could not let go of Wen Xiao Liu but it makes  thing more difficult for him when she truly was Princess of Gao Xing. Xiao Yao hated waiting and not believe in promises. However, since she has longing for Jing which she could not severed she is willing to wait 15 years. 

 Winny Aye:

Wrap Up

Collected all your parts and @Peng-Peng ones : will share as usual in our TH explo thread s1/s2 as soon as i finish the global analysis!  :) Thanx for your time <3!

Have a happy and  a good day ! :D

 peng-peng:

Xl wants Jing to be the light to shine on her dark heart and like Wynny said she wants him to  guide her to open her heart.  

My fav too! <3  :

             Lord's Heart Illuminating the Lady's Heart:

Shi Qi looked at Xiao Liu “A person cannot choose their birth, even if we are unwilling, we must accept it.” Shi Qi smiled warmly, a clear and gentle smile “If a heart is like a clean moon, even in the darkened clouds it will pass and the moon will return.”

1. Birth and Acceptance:

   • The statement "A person cannot choose their birth, even if we are unwilling, we must accept it" touches on the fundamental aspect of life that is beyond our control. Birth, in this context,  symbolize the circumstances and conditions into which an individual is born – be it social status, family, or even personal predispositions. The call for acceptance implies a broader philosophical perspective, suggesting that to find peace or contentment, one must come to terms with their origins and the inherent limitations they bring.

2. Heart as the Moon:

   • Describing the heart as a clean moon symbolizes purity, serenity, and emotional clarity. The moon often represents the cyclical nature of life and emotions. By aligning the heart with the moon, there's an implication that emotions, like the moon, have phases – waxing and waning but maintaining an intrinsic purity.

3. Darkened Clouds:

   • Darkened clouds represent challenges, hardships, or emotional turbidity. They signify the inevitable difficulties that arise in life. The fact that the moon passes through these clouds and returns suggests an enduring purity or goodness within the heart that can withstand and transcend adversity.

4. Moon's Return in Clouds:

   • The return of the moon even in the presence of clouds becomes a symbol of hope, resilience, and the cyclical nature of life. It conveys the idea that, no matter how obscured emotions become due to life's challenges, there is an inherent capability for emotional renewal and restoration.

5. Tainted Heart:

   • The notion of a tainted heart introduces a complex and nuanced element. A tainted heart  represent the impact of negative experiences, trauma, or moral struggles. This introduces the idea that external factors can influence the purity of the heart, setting the stage for a discussion on the malleability and resilience of the human spirit.

6. Lord's Heart Illuminating the Lady's Heart:

   • This part explores the transformative power of love. The inquiry into whether the lord's heart can be clear like the moon and shine on the lady's tainted heart delves into the potential for positive influence and redemption through love. It suggests that love, like the moonlight, has the power to cleanse and bring emotional clarity to a heart that has been affected by darkness.

7. Moonlight as Cleansing and Illuminating:

   • The metaphor of moonlight as cleansing and illuminating further emphasizes the positive and transformative qualities of love. Moonlight is gentle, and its gradual illumination of the heart implies a patient and understanding approach to healing emotional wounds. It suggests that love has the power to purify and bring clarity to a heart even when it has been tarnished.

This symbolic analysis reveals a narrative that explores themes of acceptance, the cyclical nature of life, resilience in the face of challenges, and the transformative power of love in healing and restoring the human spirit. The moon serves as a central metaphor, weaving together these themes :) . We already covered the starry night and the wishing sky for Xiao Liu and Jing in previous analysis. Pointing at their dipest wishes - and their destiny. And now as Xiao Liu is to re-embrace her appearance => the Moon / the feminity and her heart.

Xiao Liu pointed to her heart and asked half in jest half serious “But if the lady’s heart is tainted, then will my lord’s heart be clear like the moon and shine it on the lady’s heart.”  

1. Pointing to Her Heart:

   • Xiao Liu physically gestures to her heart, symbolizing a direct and personal connection to her emotions and inner self. The heart, in various cultures, is often associated with emotions, love, and the core of one's being.

2. Lady’s Tainted Heart:

   • The idea of the lady having a tainted heart introduces a symbol of impurity or darkness,  caused by negative experiences, regrets, or moral conflicts. It symbolizes the complex nature of human emotions and the potential for emotional scars.

3. Lord’s Heart Clear Like the Moon:

   • The lord's heart being compared to the clear moon symbolizes purity, enlightenment, and emotional transparency. This suggests that the lord embodies qualities of clarity, calmness, and  a higher understanding, akin to the serene and luminous moon.

4. Shining on the Lady’s Heart:

   • The act of the lord's heart shining on the lady's tainted heart symbolizes the transformative power of love. It suggests that the positive qualities within the lord have the potential to bring light, clarity, and healing to the lady's troubled or tainted emotions. This imply redemption and the ability of love to overcome darkness, and the complications.

5. Moonlight as Illumination:

   • The moonlight here serves as a metaphor for the illuminating and transformative power of love. Just as the moonlight gently illuminates the darkness, the lord's love has the potential to bring understanding, acceptance, and emotional healing to the lady. This is Jing's power to her.

6. Jest and Seriousness:

   • Xiao Liu's question being half in jest and half serious adds complexity. On one hand, there's a lighthearted or playful element,  indicating a familiarity or comfort in discussing such matters. On the other hand, the serious aspect implies a genuine concern or curiosity about the potential impact of emotions on the dynamics between the lord and the lady.

7. Dual Nature of Emotions:

   • The dual nature of the question reflects the inherent dualities in emotions – light and darkness, jest and seriousness. It suggests that emotions are multi-faceted and can be both complex and simple, depending on the emotional context, wich is very rich for her in this chapter (10). 

Between the lord and the lady, there emerges a metaphorical journey — a tender exploration of emotional healing and the delicate prospect of redemption. Love, depicted as a genuine and clear-hearted force, becomes the gentle yet powerful catalyst for the possibility of illuminating even the darkest corners of the heart. 

The comparison of Jing's heart to the clear moon signifies not just purity but a luminosity that possesses the ability to transcend the darkness , be it in her own heart. 

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In related  episode 16 there this little scenery too, where she share her worrying to Jing , just before there parting :

.....hahahahaha ....(I cant help but smile here)...

Xiao Liu's reaction?

=> 

Oh she looks content right ! ?:D With her...oh so happy face <3 !

Shared Understanding and Integration:

• Text: "You’re not."
• Analysis: Tu Shan Jing's simple denial of Xiao Liu being ugly represent a symbolic acceptance of her true self. In Jungian terms, this could be seen as an acknowledgment and integration of both the outer appearance and the inner self, fostering a sense of understanding and unity.

Shared Experiences and Self-Discovery:

• Text: "Everyone can appreciate a beautiful exterior, if I am the only one who can admire your beautiful interior then I’m happy."
• Analysis: Tu Shan Jing's emphasis on appreciating Xiao Liu's inner beauty hints at a shared understanding of deeper qualities. This signify a journey of self-discovery for both characters, exploring and valuing aspects beyond the superficial.
• Text:"Xiao Liu pointed to her heart and asked half in jest, half serious, 'But if the lady’s heart is tainted, then will my lord’s heart be clear like the moon and shine it on the lady’s heart.'"
• Analysis:
  • In this dialogue, Xiao Liu employs a metaphor involving the moon and heart, a poetic and symbolic way of expressing emotions. The mention of the moon often signifies purity and illumination in various cultural contexts. Xiao Liu's question, though presented in a half-jesting manner, holds a deeper layer of inquiry into the purity of Tu Shan Jing's heart. It reveals Xiao Liu's awareness of emotional complexities and the potential influence one person's emotions can have on another. This interaction foreshadows a nuanced exploration of their relationship dynamics, suggesting that emotional transparency and influence play a significant role in their connection.
  • @@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@

I realised something while reading chapter 1 and 12 

The meeting of each ML with their future lover parallel their relationship

XiaoJing= XY healed TSJ. Their relationship developed into them healing each other deep scars

XiaoLiu = XL control wxl, he end up always controling her until she broke out of his control and their relationship end.

ZX and Fen Long's sister=  Their music was harmonious until  it was i nterupted by someone ZX cared about. She  contunued to pkzh thrying to get him to join again but he did. She got angry and stopped. This is how their relationship went and ended.

ZX abd A Nian : she always listened to him when she was young, her always get her  way and well she end up getting her way to be  with him . I do not know what their relationship will be but I feel sorry for Zhuan Xu to have her as his 2nd empress.  She will never challenge him   seems since she does not sound bright  ( sorry I so do not like her lol) 

 Winny Aye:

17 hours ago
@AH

I don't know exactly how XY viewed her relationship with XL at this point in the story in her mind. Since the novel doesn't explicitly show us her thoughts on that subject, we can only speculate based on the things she says and does and other context clues. I suppose it's possible that XY might think of XL as a soulmate in her mind at this point in the story. But even if she did, I don't think she would use that word out loud in a conversation with XL. That would be too close to being a confession, which would be very out of character for XY and not in keeping with her 15 year promise to TSJ.

Well in that particular chapter, Xiao Yao was also seeing Jing at sometimes at Sheng Nong Mountain (washing his hair) while also going out with FFB and practicing  archery. She had wanted Jing to ask her about her outing with FFB,  but Jing didn't, maybe because he understood that they both had tie to the other person at the time.
But then in another scene XY and FFB encountered with Jing and Yi Yang at bow shop. Because of that she made FFB bought the bow for her instead of using Jing's money. (FFB gave it to beggers). All those her making beautiful poison food after the scene she was with Jing and worrying about him, and was sort of  telling herself with berated feelings towards Yi Yang.She was sort of worried about Jing and suspiciois on Yi Yang. In earlier chapters in the novel it's said very very clearly tha she also missed Xiang Liu, fearsome creature who could make her not think about her heartwrenching either from her mom or Jing. It's implied in novel she loved making poison putting all those longing, heartwrenching into poison craft. She also sort liked it when XL came to her when she was having sort of heartwrench feelings, because with the fear of life in front of her she won't have to suffer heartwrench. It's more like healing fear with fear.

In all the context, I don't even know how is it possible for her to even think about being soulmate with this guy.

 Winny Aye:

Although if we really research about soulmate, it's not neccessarily a romantic partner. But  then it's not something many think when they saw the word "soulmate". So that translation is misleading.

Yes, XY's interactions with XL/FFB and TSJ throughout the story and particularly in chapter 19 give an indication of how she felt about them and how she viewed them at that point in the story.

In chapter 19, XY allows TSJ to hug her and hugs him back after she finds out that he wasn't harmed in the assassination attempt.

She also tells him that as long as he doesn't marry, she will keep her 15 year promise, and that her reason for not going to see him was not that she had someone else in her heart, but rather because TSJ had gone to the weapons shop with FFYY even though he promised XY that he would end his engagement with FFYY. Although that's not the same as saying that she didn't have anyone else in her heart (full stop), it definitely conveys the idea that TSJ spending time with FFYY upset XY and that XY intended to remain committed to TSJ as long as he kept his side of their promise. 

-----

Chapter 19:

Xiao Yao watched Zhuan Xu leave before turning to Jing. He suddenly grabbed her in a tight embrace and his damp body immediately soaked her through. She hugged him back and lightly held onto him as if to give him warmth.

After a huge scare, Xiao Yao wasn’t in the mood to be angry at him anymore. “I didn’t come see you not because I had someone else in my heart, but because I was unhappy. You said you would end the engagement, so what was that in the weapons store?”

“A friend invited Yi Yang and I to visit and that friend collects daggers so I went to buy a present and ran into Yi Yang on the street and she insisted on coming with me.”

“Did you bring up ending the engagement with Yi Yang?”

Jing answered, “Yi Yang was becoming colder and colder to me and I wanted to find time to discuss with her about ending it, but after Feng Long’s birthday, she suddenly changed her attitude and was so solicitous of me. She even mentioned to my grandmother how she was often looked down upon as if hinting she wants to get married sooner. Grandmother always felt like she didn’t do enough for Yi Yang who suffered a lot, so she came to plead with me to give Yi Yang a title. Even if I like another girl, I can just marry another concubine.”

Xiao Yao pushed him. “Dream on!”

Jing grabbed her quickly. “I didn’t say yes! I couldn’t convince my grandmother so I went to talk to Yi Yang about her ending the engagement. I told her I liked someone else and wanted to cancel our engagement. I was willing to give her whatever compensation she wanted. But Yi Yang said she didn’t care how many women I married as long as she was my first wife.”

Xiao Yao laughed. “Can’t imagine she’s so magnanimous! I think you should marry her and then later you marry your own harem and live in bliss!”

Jing said painfully, “Xiao Yao, stop mocking me! Can’t you understand? Because she could care less about me, that is why she doesn’t care. All she wants is the title of the wife of the Tu Shan clan leader!”

Xiao Yao stopped smiling and asked, “And then?”

“Yi Yang knew I wanted to end the engagement and went to cry in front of my grandmother. She reminded her that years ago her dad wanted to end the engagement and she put on her wedding dress and came to Qing Qiu. She never thought about leaving after that. If I want to kick her out, then she’ll kill herself because she wasn’t good enough for me. She said she was willing to serve the same husband with other women and be filial to grandmother….. Now grandmother thinks I’m the one being unreasonable and refuses to end the engagement. Yi Yang comes off as understanding and open-minded so grandmother is completely on her side.”

Xiao Yao asked, “So you guys are stuck at an impasse?”

Jing nodded his head. “I can’t end the engagement, they can’t force me to marry Yi Yang.”

Xiao Yao sighed – just like Zhuan Xu said, it would be very difficult for Jing to end the engagement.

Xiao Xiao whooshed past on her winged ride as if to remind Xiao Yao it was time to go back. Xiao Yao said, “I promised you fifteen years. As long as you don’t marry, I’ll keep that promise. Don’t worry about Yi Yang for now. Gege said there were over a dozen assassins. Who do you think was behind it? Hou?”

-----

However, your previous comment about the meaning of the term "soulmate" makes me mindful to remember that it doesn't always have a romantic connotation. 

Based on everything that we are shown about the character's thoughts, words, and actions by chapter 19, we can guess at how XY viewed XL at that point, but I don't think we can say definitively whether she would use a term like "soulmate" to describe how she viewed him in her own mind (if not out loud). Especially given the fact that "soulmate" can sometimes be used without a romantic connotation. 

 Winny Aye:

Nevertheless, Xy had never consider XL as her enemy I think there is a time she want to call him pal or friend. But XL is ZX's enemy, so she did want him to be just dashig FFB who was her mentor  in archery

I agree that XY viewed XL as CX's enemy and not her own enemy at this point, and that she wanted him to be something like a friend (although not necessarily in a way that precluded romantic feelings).

XY tells her father that XL is "a friend who is not quite a friend" when he catches her looking at her memory of XL under the ocean in chapter 13. 

In chapter 16, FFB becomes her archery teacher and constant companion for two years. After she finds out for sure that FFB is XL in chapter 17, he continues in those roles for a while and XY wishes that he could be FFB forever in this chapter (and has a similar thought later on in chapter 25). 

-----

Chapter 19:

Bei ate the final bite and put down his chopstick. He took a sip of wine and casually said, “Not bad.”

Xiao Yao stared at the empty plate and her heart soared. “The only person who can make poisons this tasty in the entire world is me!”

Bei laughed back, “And the only person in the entire world who can appreciate your great “cooking” talents is me!”

Xiao Yao sassed back, “It’s enough to have a true [zhi ji (知己)] [知音"  (zhī yīn)] .”

Bei gave her a half-smile but said nothing.

Xiao Yao asked, “Can you continue teaching me archery now?” What she really meant to ask was – are you not angry at me anymore?

Bei finished his wine. “I need to leave for a bit, wait for me to come back.”

Xiao Yao figured he was going back to Qing Shui town. Even if there was no active warfare, he was still the General of the Sheng Nong resistance army and there was much he had to do.

Xiao Yao couldn’t help it and sighed loudly and murmured, “If only you could forever be Fang Feng Bei, that would be so great.”

Bei appeared not to have heard her as he set down his wine cup and got up to leave, his form disappearing in the layers of curtains.

-----

Even if XY had directly used the word "friend" with no qualifiers to describe her relationship with XL by this point in the story, IMO, that still wouldn't necessarily mean that she definitely viewed him in a strictly platonic way. 

For example, when XY and Ah Nian have a conversation in chapter 31 they discuss the events of chapter 13 when XY went to the beach to see TSJ but was intercepted by Ah Nian who pushed XY into the ocean where XL was waiting for her. In that conversation, XY refers to TSJ as a friend, but obviously that doesn't indicate that XY didn't have romantic feelings for TSJ. Presumably there just wasn't a better word that XY felt comfortable using to describe her relationship with TSJ at that point in front of Ah Nian. 

-----

Chapter 31:

Ah Nian also looked out on the horizon and sighed. “I remember it was near here that I pushed you into the ocean. Back then I was so unhappy but now I realize it was nothing.”

Xiao Yao smiled. “You’ve grown up.”

Ah Nian asked “Jiejie, what were you doing that night here?”

Xiao Yao said, “I came to see a friend.”

“Then later, did that Nine-headed demon Xiang Liu continue to harass you?”

Xiao Yao shook her head.

Ah Nian said, “I thought that demon was pretty fascinating.”

Xiao Yao looked back out over the blue ocean and said nothing.

@AH

 In that conversation, XY refers to TSJ as a friend, but obviously that doesn't indicate that XY didn't have romantic feelings for TSJ.

Well if you are refering this one strict line of what she said to compare with her referring to XL as her friend, I suggest you to compare r list out all her actions and thoughts towards both men in all 51 chapters. Especially if you are choosing to tell it because I said TH writing and her writing for female lead feelings are very straight forward. Sorry...even with her saying "Our hearts beat as one" (to test if he was XL) does not convince me still that she had any of those romantic feelings..Because in the next scene she was wishing her going out with FFB news to reach to Jing. Despite, there maybe romantic objects such as fireflies, clamshell, mermaid couple and such I still did rarely feel her romantic feelings in such a way towards XL/FFB. Or it's still very vague despite the fact there is beautiful memory (probably refering to moments with FFB), because friendship can be beautiful too. One thing is for sure theres is not a line make me think she felt FFB in such belonging (as husband wife do) way as she was to Jing. Even to end she just wanted him to go well with life after all there was a meaningful bond between them but if he did not want that to stay with her severed all ties, and she actually moved on after all.  It's so clear they never belong to each other.