infiniti512 wrote: I was enjoying this drama up to episode 10. I'm suddenly questioning the writers. *
For one, after being betrayed, not for a few thousand but a quarter of a BILLION dollars, he still looks for Asahina? I understand a man changing from cold hearted to a more caring and trusting person, but that's just flat out stupid to chase after him like some sad puppy who has been abused by his master. I was thinking I was misunderstanding and he just wanted closure but his statement that he was going back to NI seems to prove me wrong.
And why was Yoko the one who takes him to his mother? It should have been Makoto or even better, that he went alone. I understand she was needed for him to voice that he now liked Makoto but that could have been told in a different way. Yoko's character has bothered me from day one. Her smiles in your face then her random evil moments were unnecessary. I know you need a second lead actress because that's the drama formula, but she just threw things off when it didnt need to be and didnt make things more interesting.
And also, why would you go back the company you were kicked out from? Yeah it was yours to begin with but you were on the road to start something bigger and better with your knew found outlook on life. To go back for the man who betrayed you again is just plain stupid. It's okay to forgive, but you can't just forget. And you definitely cant go back to way things were or else it's not fair to you. It's not a matter of being a bigger person, it's a matter of protecting yourself.
And seriously, is there ever going to be a confession?! *
Anyhow, I look forward to the ending. I hope it rights itself and I don't end up as disappointed as I am now.
i agree with some of what u said. may or may not be spoiler ***
i also feel that yoko was a wasted character. it's like the writers could not decide if she was good or bad so they left her dangling in the middle by having her say the occasional mean comment then make her be nice again. i don't think she had to be a bad person period. they could have just made better use of her. there was the restaurant sl that just got lost somewhere out there. we still don't know who was threatening her and messing with her online. that was also a waste.
i too am a bit confused by hyuga's reaction to asahina. in a way i can understand because of the relationship they had and the empire they built and the nostalgic value in that. but i agree with you, how will they ever be able to go back to that? assume asahina is let out will he go back to being hyuga's 2nd best? how can he with the resentment he felt that led him to do what he did and then the guilt that resulted from it? and how can hyuga ever really trust him? like u said forgiveness is one thing...
here is where i disagree. i like that yoko was the one that went with him. i think the trip was closure for both of them. he learnt his mom was doing ok and he doesn't resent her and yoko seems have solidified and accepted their level of friendship. i also disagree about him going back to NI. it's his baby. he nurtured and watched it grow and it has hurt him to see it being destroyed. i can understand why he wants to go back. plus it will be the biggest ego boost if after everything he can bring the company back into prosperity. it's also a new test that will allow him to keep growing.
where i question the writers is the dumb move by natsui to leave now. i get it's for dramatic effect but it's so cliche and unnecessary. why does the guy always have to chase after the girl in these things. she likes him too. she has helped him grow and change, she recognised his walls and helped to break them down and then she leaves. *rolling eyes* she could have just confessed to him. she did all the hard work already and anyone with eyes can see she likes him.****
the romance sub plot of this drama i could have honestly done without cuz it's so cliche and disappointing. and yet again we're going to have to wait for a mere kiss. i really hope it's not one of those boring japanese peck kisses with no feeling.
boutux wrote: i agree with some of what u said. may or may not be spoiler ***
i also feel that yoko was a wasted character. it's like the writers could not decide if she was good or bad so they left her dangling in the middle by having her say the occasional mean comment then make her be nice again. i don't think she had to be a bad person period. they could have just made better use of her. there was the restaurant sl that just got lost somewhere out there. we still don't know who was threatening her and messing with her online. that was also a waste.
i too am a bit confused by hyuga's reaction to asahina. in a way i can understand because of the relationship they had and the empire they built and the nostalgic value in that. but i agree with you, how will they ever be able to go back to that? assume asahina is let out will he go back to being hyuga's 2nd best? how can he with the resentment he felt that led him to do what he did and then the guilt that resulted from it? and how can hyuga ever really trust him? like u said forgiveness is one thing...
here is where i disagree. i like that yoko was the one that went with him. i think the trip was closure for both of them. he learnt his mom was doing ok and he doesn't resent her and yoko seems have solidified and accepted their level of friendship. i also disagree about him going back to NI. it's his baby. he nurtured and watched it grow and it has hurt him to see it being destroyed. i can understand why he wants to go back. plus it will be the biggest ego boost if after everything he can bring the company back into prosperity. it's also a new test that will allow him to keep growing.
where i question the writers is the dumb move by natsui to leave now. i get it's for dramatic effect but it's so cliche and unnecessary. why does the guy always have to chase after the girl in these things. she likes him too. she has helped him grow and change, she recognised his walls and helped to break them down and then she leaves. *rolling eyes* she could have just confessed to him. she did all the hard work already and anyone with eyes can see she likes him.****
the romance sub plot of this drama i could have honestly done without cuz it's so cliche and disappointing. and yet again we're going to have to wait for a mere kiss. i really hope it's not one of those boring japanese peck kisses with no feeling.
You make some good points. * I do think the reason for Yoko taking him to his mother was for closure. Maybe she felt guilty for hurting him that last time trying to make it seem like Makoto was with her brother, and it was definitely for him to realize who was important to him. But still, I wish it was done a different way. Like you said, she was wasted.
I thought about his urge to right the sinking ship of NI but he voiced his reason for going back as for Asahina to have something to come back to. For that reason, I don’t think he should go back, but if it’s truly to fix NI then I can understand. There could be some very loud “I told you sos” to the shareholders once he’s done haha.
I actually thought Makoto was going to be the one to confess first but at the end of the day, she is the heroine, the one that most girls watching imagine being and she has to be relatable I guess. Women fantasize about their “confession” by the man they love, so maybe that’s what the writer wants us to wait for. From the looks of the preview, I wonder if we’ll get it….. *
yes! to almost everything said above. Episode 10 for me was a big WTH?!!!
I understand that Hyuga and Asahina have a long history of building next innovation. but Asahina's total betrayal makes it that much more horrible! Not only did he sabatoge the company and his friend's reputation, he hasn't once shown remorse to Hyuga. and over what? Some jealousy over being seen as his second? With only two exceptions, most people in that company CLEARLY RESPECTED Asahina. they went to him for almost everything when it came to dealing with people and business matters in the company because Hyuga was so prickly and eccentric. To me his betrayal is 'just about' unforgivable. So having said that....
I can understand why Hyuga would want to forgive him...but blindly? he hasn't even seen Asahina yet to find out if his sneaky betraying friend is sorry!
Just like others have expressed... He pulled those three workers from Next Innovation and gave them hope of starting something new TOGETHER. they started Wonder Wall and It was all going in this really cool fresh new direction. Cutting ties with the old and the negative associations of Next Innovation. WHAT THE HELL? He's going back? And leaving those three LOYAL MEN behind?
One could argue he's 'doing them a favor' and giving them this company ... I don't agree and I don't like it. I think Hyuga is letting those men down by going back and having the cocky ex employee "take care of them"
As for the last minute "let's keep the two lovers apart until the last episode" plot device... They did it poorly. I don't understand either of their motivations for standing there and not speaking to each other when Hyuga found her at her work.
Lastly, when Hyuga went to go see his mother... I am okay with Yoko being the one who went with him, and I am satisfied with the resolution of that.
Like Boutux said... Yoko was a wasted character. I am actually kind of sad that she and the chef didn't get a little side love story. Their antagonistic / attraction / chemistry could TOTALLY FLOAT A WHOLE Jdrama on it's own!! Wish they could have made that one too!
I will be waiting for Episode 11 and I hope this last one redeems #10. This has been a pretty good series so far. It's not the quality of "Pride" for me but it has been really fun to watch... Please let this last episode be good!
END SPOILERS :)
I understand that Hyuga and Asahina have a long history of building next innovation. but Asahina's total betrayal makes it that much more horrible! Not only did he sabatoge the company and his friend's reputation, he hasn't once shown remorse to Hyuga. and over what? Some jealousy over being seen as his second? With only two exceptions, most people in that company CLEARLY RESPECTED Asahina. they went to him for almost everything when it came to dealing with people and business matters in the company because Hyuga was so prickly and eccentric. To me his betrayal is 'just about' unforgivable. So having said that....
I can understand why Hyuga would want to forgive him...but blindly? he hasn't even seen Asahina yet to find out if his sneaky betraying friend is sorry!
Just like others have expressed... He pulled those three workers from Next Innovation and gave them hope of starting something new TOGETHER. they started Wonder Wall and It was all going in this really cool fresh new direction. Cutting ties with the old and the negative associations of Next Innovation. WHAT THE HELL? He's going back? And leaving those three LOYAL MEN behind?
One could argue he's 'doing them a favor' and giving them this company ... I don't agree and I don't like it. I think Hyuga is letting those men down by going back and having the cocky ex employee "take care of them"
As for the last minute "let's keep the two lovers apart until the last episode" plot device... They did it poorly. I don't understand either of their motivations for standing there and not speaking to each other when Hyuga found her at her work.
Lastly, when Hyuga went to go see his mother... I am okay with Yoko being the one who went with him, and I am satisfied with the resolution of that.
Like Boutux said... Yoko was a wasted character. I am actually kind of sad that she and the chef didn't get a little side love story. Their antagonistic / attraction / chemistry could TOTALLY FLOAT A WHOLE Jdrama on it's own!! Wish they could have made that one too!
I will be waiting for Episode 11 and I hope this last one redeems #10. This has been a pretty good series so far. It's not the quality of "Pride" for me but it has been really fun to watch... Please let this last episode be good!
END SPOILERS :)
Rourou wrote: That would be 10 and 17 September.
Back to the drama : I've seen 6 episodes, i wonder what will happen next.
Phew, that's great. I can watch both before leaving civilisation, in BKK. but back to the drama :) I'm not even mad at no kissing or typical romance in the plot. I like their chemistry - like two people a bit messed up by their complexes but really emotional. They'll be great together, not just a fling. And I love how there is no redundant messy character to irritate us and add to frustration. I enjoy K-drama but J-dramas win over with this no-nonsense scenarios. Rich Man, Poor Woman is just perfect, I got jealous of the scriptwriters's talents.
last episode. all i can say is i'm a bit disappointed. spoilers***
the kiss--granted they did kiss twice but it was exactly what i hate about romance in japnese dramas. that was not a kiss that was just 2 lips touching. i'm not saying they have to play tonsil hockey but real kisses have ppl's heads moving, lips moving, caressing etc. it was so dead and boring. oguri shun's 2nd boring narita airport kiss in a drama (hello hana kimi). only actor i've seen kiss passionately in his dramas is matsujun.
ok so i watched it raw on tv so i'm not sure what was said but i didn't like that wonder wall guys came back to help NI. at this point i don't think they should have anything to do with that company if they are trying to build their own. at the very least hyuga should have to ask them for help and pay them for it but it seems they came to save the day on their own. which in fact they shouldn't really know what is happening at NI.
i think everyone just kinda let asahina off the hook like what he did was no big deal. in reality, in japanese reality he could never come back to NI he would just be dead weight. he is no longer good for what his role was at NI. everyone knows what he did and in the business world no one would work with him cuz they can't trust him. and he ruin his own reputation he would have a hard time getting a job with any firm...no one would touch him and therefore no one would touch NI. so for everything to be okay with just an apology and bow is ridiculous. he didn't even go down on his knees. i don't get the feeling that he is very remorseful either.
i hate that it was cliche like every other romantic comedy and the guy has to chase after the girl and even more cliche in the japanese sense cuz hyuga was literally running. that said i did like that the entire company was involved in helping him find her at the airport. that was kinda funny. and i'm glad she still went on her trip.
overall i'm disappointed because the 100% happy ending was not necessary. asahina does not deserve a happy ending. he should have remained in jail and he should not be allowed back at NI. NI is rebounding and that's cool. yoko is back to bickering with the sexy chef and that's cool. we got the happy couple and yay! (heavy on the sarcasm) i feel like they tried to correct so many wrongs in the last epi and it was mess. they needed more epis to work everything out properly if they truly wanted the happy endings to work well. it just feels rushed at the end in one episode. and the last 2 epis don't do justice to how great this drama truly was.
****end of rant/spoilers.
the kiss--granted they did kiss twice but it was exactly what i hate about romance in japnese dramas. that was not a kiss that was just 2 lips touching. i'm not saying they have to play tonsil hockey but real kisses have ppl's heads moving, lips moving, caressing etc. it was so dead and boring. oguri shun's 2nd boring narita airport kiss in a drama (hello hana kimi). only actor i've seen kiss passionately in his dramas is matsujun.
ok so i watched it raw on tv so i'm not sure what was said but i didn't like that wonder wall guys came back to help NI. at this point i don't think they should have anything to do with that company if they are trying to build their own. at the very least hyuga should have to ask them for help and pay them for it but it seems they came to save the day on their own. which in fact they shouldn't really know what is happening at NI.
i think everyone just kinda let asahina off the hook like what he did was no big deal. in reality, in japanese reality he could never come back to NI he would just be dead weight. he is no longer good for what his role was at NI. everyone knows what he did and in the business world no one would work with him cuz they can't trust him. and he ruin his own reputation he would have a hard time getting a job with any firm...no one would touch him and therefore no one would touch NI. so for everything to be okay with just an apology and bow is ridiculous. he didn't even go down on his knees. i don't get the feeling that he is very remorseful either.
i hate that it was cliche like every other romantic comedy and the guy has to chase after the girl and even more cliche in the japanese sense cuz hyuga was literally running. that said i did like that the entire company was involved in helping him find her at the airport. that was kinda funny. and i'm glad she still went on her trip.
overall i'm disappointed because the 100% happy ending was not necessary. asahina does not deserve a happy ending. he should have remained in jail and he should not be allowed back at NI. NI is rebounding and that's cool. yoko is back to bickering with the sexy chef and that's cool. we got the happy couple and yay! (heavy on the sarcasm) i feel like they tried to correct so many wrongs in the last epi and it was mess. they needed more epis to work everything out properly if they truly wanted the happy endings to work well. it just feels rushed at the end in one episode. and the last 2 epis don't do justice to how great this drama truly was.
****end of rant/spoilers.
So I justed finished the last episode and I haven't decided how I feel about it yet.
*On one hand the last 2 episodes didn't do the drama justices but on ther other hand the ending still kinda fit the relationship between Hyuga Toru and Natsui Makoto. But I was disappointed that Hyuga took Asahina back because that is unrealistic. I can still kinda understand why Hyuga went back to NI but I think it would have been better if he'd stayed with Wonderwall.
Now the kiss scene granted there was two! There wasn't much feel to them. Just two lips touching... But hey at least we got a kiss scene right?*
*On one hand the last 2 episodes didn't do the drama justices but on ther other hand the ending still kinda fit the relationship between Hyuga Toru and Natsui Makoto. But I was disappointed that Hyuga took Asahina back because that is unrealistic. I can still kinda understand why Hyuga went back to NI but I think it would have been better if he'd stayed with Wonderwall.
Now the kiss scene granted there was two! There wasn't much feel to them. Just two lips touching... But hey at least we got a kiss scene right?*
I finished the drama a while ago, i didn't have high expectations for this drama to start with so i wasn't disappointed, it was a nice drama with Oguri Shun who i haven't seen for a long time, it had a great OST and an acceptable storyline. The ending was really cliche and expected, the airoport scene was more than dumb (I hate those scenes because they exist in every romantic comedy out there).
Overall i end up giving it an 8 which is more than enough in my opinion. Yes it could have been better but it doesn't matter.
I finished this yesterday morning and had even rated it 10 because I thought the chemistry was good between Oguri's and Ishihara's characters (although I think the bonding of the two at the end was not enough). Another good thing was that there were no typical J-drama cheesy long speeches. Hyuga was gruff and not so romantic. Natsui was shy and non-confrontational but I thought she was bubbly and funny at times.
But after reading back, I agree that one major flaw was when > Hyuga wanted Asahina back at NI--this was not realistic. And I have mixed feelings about the whole build-another-company-but-come-back-to-the-old-one-which-your-bff-ruined.<.
But after reading back, I agree that one major flaw was when > Hyuga wanted Asahina back at NI--this was not realistic. And I have mixed feelings about the whole build-another-company-but-come-back-to-the-old-one-which-your-bff-ruined.<.
I love that you can watch a Japanese drama in the span of a couple of days. They are short and fun and mostly sweet, however, I feel like some of them tend to be rushed at the end and this was one of them.
*I did like that she kind of forced him to admit his feelings but I feel that the airport scene was typical of a drama, and yes the kiss was robotish. Japanese dramas I've seen with adult themes tend to have more passionate kiss scenes than its Korean counterparts but this one was just bleh. I got the feel of a kdrama when he basically kissed her to shut her up. I did however like that he let her go to Brazil, showing his growth in not pushing her around.
As for Asahina, I can't stress how wrong that was to me. I get that Hyuga went back to NI and Asahina should have gone to bow and apologize, but leave it at that. Who can trust a man who ruined the company? Definitely the shareholders wouldnt given how they threw tomatoes at Hyuga basically for what Asahina did. But of course the drama ends there so we don't know if he was really allowed back into the company.
The wonderwall guys should not have stayed at NI. They could have gone back to help with the project maybe as paid contractors and then gone back to continue wonderwall's growth. That would have been more realistic.
The last 2 episodes were rushed and it seemed that the conflict between Makoto and Hyuga were exaggerated for effect and again the NI stuff totally unrealistic, but I am still satisfied with the ending. *
I rated it a 9 previously and I guess I will stick to it. Ah Shun....You are just too good looking.... ^^
*I did like that she kind of forced him to admit his feelings but I feel that the airport scene was typical of a drama, and yes the kiss was robotish. Japanese dramas I've seen with adult themes tend to have more passionate kiss scenes than its Korean counterparts but this one was just bleh. I got the feel of a kdrama when he basically kissed her to shut her up. I did however like that he let her go to Brazil, showing his growth in not pushing her around.
As for Asahina, I can't stress how wrong that was to me. I get that Hyuga went back to NI and Asahina should have gone to bow and apologize, but leave it at that. Who can trust a man who ruined the company? Definitely the shareholders wouldnt given how they threw tomatoes at Hyuga basically for what Asahina did. But of course the drama ends there so we don't know if he was really allowed back into the company.
The wonderwall guys should not have stayed at NI. They could have gone back to help with the project maybe as paid contractors and then gone back to continue wonderwall's growth. That would have been more realistic.
The last 2 episodes were rushed and it seemed that the conflict between Makoto and Hyuga were exaggerated for effect and again the NI stuff totally unrealistic, but I am still satisfied with the ending. *
I rated it a 9 previously and I guess I will stick to it. Ah Shun....You are just too good looking.... ^^
I had no problems with the ending except that it ended a little quicker than I would have liked to. But it was not as if there were any loose ends with regards to the storyline.
Hyuga dealt with himself and Asahina very well and I am glad both returned to the company.
Unlike many of you whom may be more accustomed to the culture of making out/sex with relatively unfamiliar people, I felt the kiss at the end was very appropriate for the occasion.
I rated it 9 as it was a great drama. Fantastic acting, great scriptwriting, and fitting music.
Unlike many others here, I never felt it was a masterpiece regardless of the ending, which I reiterate, was as solid as any of the prior episodes.
I agree with the general feeling of the forum - they could have ended it a wee bit better, but since when has a poor end ever stood in the way of me loving a drama! (well, maybe once)
>> The kiss scene was predictable and meh, but I was already resigned that it wouldn't be great, so that kinda gets a pass.
I can almost understand Hyuga reconciling with Asahina, and to some extent diving back into NI to save it. But I personally would have liked him to then return (with the guys) to WW. It felt like WW was just a means to an end which, story-line wise, it was - but still.
Makoto still going to Brazil . . . hmmm - it didn't really feel like there was any point to that, as she was basically just running away from her feelings, which when it was revealed that they were reciprocated – should have resulted with a 'Ace! now I don't have to go, and can find work closer to home – and this time a job which wont make me sleep on a sofa in the lab!' It wasn't really portrayed well that she was sold on the job enough to still leave the bloke she fancies the pants off, and move half-way round the world. I for one would have said 'sod the job, I'm going back to work with him!' - but that's just me. <<
Other leading characters all did well, and we had our typical J-drama speeches - which are always amaaaaaaaaaazin ;-)
All in, I loved it, but then was I was always going to say that – Hello, it's Oguri Shun, what's not to like?!
for me - I'm going for a 9. ^^ Yup, I'm a sucker for J-drama sentimentality, speeches that make the world right, and no matter what you do, if you apologise sincerely you will always receive forgiveness.
>> The kiss scene was predictable and meh, but I was already resigned that it wouldn't be great, so that kinda gets a pass.
I can almost understand Hyuga reconciling with Asahina, and to some extent diving back into NI to save it. But I personally would have liked him to then return (with the guys) to WW. It felt like WW was just a means to an end which, story-line wise, it was - but still.
Makoto still going to Brazil . . . hmmm - it didn't really feel like there was any point to that, as she was basically just running away from her feelings, which when it was revealed that they were reciprocated – should have resulted with a 'Ace! now I don't have to go, and can find work closer to home – and this time a job which wont make me sleep on a sofa in the lab!' It wasn't really portrayed well that she was sold on the job enough to still leave the bloke she fancies the pants off, and move half-way round the world. I for one would have said 'sod the job, I'm going back to work with him!' - but that's just me. <<
Other leading characters all did well, and we had our typical J-drama speeches - which are always amaaaaaaaaaazin ;-)
All in, I loved it, but then was I was always going to say that – Hello, it's Oguri Shun, what's not to like?!
for me - I'm going for a 9. ^^ Yup, I'm a sucker for J-drama sentimentality, speeches that make the world right, and no matter what you do, if you apologise sincerely you will always receive forgiveness.
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