HeadInTheClouds:
AH :
Since he intended to leave the Tushan clan and to return YSQ to XY at the time that he made the promise, control over ending the engagement really did rest with him as long as nothing unexpected happened to force him to stay with the clan
But like I said, the control did not rest with him
It seems that we disagree on this point.
AH :
When it comes to fictional characters, living and dying for a romantic interest isn't something that I personally view as a black mark against the character.
XianXia dramas are of course filled with this trope. And because I knew what to expect, I parked my brain on a different continent and just went with it. However, the amount of times that I want to reach into the screen and throttle some characters for this "love brain" idiocy has been too numerous to count. Probably why, despite watching so many Cdramas, there are not that many characters that I can say that I genuinely love or dramas that have stuck with me. Unfortunately, since I'm choosing to look critically at LYF, then evaluating its characters will also be more critical.
Lol, HeadInTheClouds I have to admit I find the huge discrepancy between our preferences here amusing. ^^
Most of the time when I seek out entertainment for escapism I'm looking for stories about characters with very intense feelings who are willing to make big sacrifices for the person they love / the people they care about. So this trope is often a draw for me, especially when it's done in a way where the character making the sacrifice doesn't come across as an idiot for their choice (e.g., the ending of the Princess Wei Young).
He is a coward because instead of fighting for survival he simply gave up.
He didn't want to survive. He wanted to die so he could join XY in death to be with her. That seems different to me than wanting to survive and then just giving up and not fighting for it. And his desire to join XY in death doesn't strike me as something that necessarily makes him a coward.
Jing chose to sleep for 37 years. That's 37 years of him choosing to hide, abandoning his responsibilities. You would think that at some point during those 37 years, that man would wise up or man up, but nope. He remained a coward for all 37 years.
"Choosing to hide" doesn't seem like an accurate description to me. His soul was seeking death, a permanent outcome if achieved, in order to be with XY, not to hide from something or someone.
His soul was seeking death because he thought XY was dead. As far as he was aware, that didn't change (he still thought XY was dead) during the 37 years, so even if he did have the ability to consciously choose to stop seeking death and to seek to live instead while in his coma (and I don't see why he would have that ability while comatose), why would his decision change? There was no new information that would change it.
As to your question about the other character choosing to die. A-Heng longed to die but didn't because she remembered her responsibility towards XY. This is different to what Jing did.
I don't agree with that characterization of why Ah Heng survived until she met XY instead of dying with Chi You.
When Chi You was dying, Ah Heng wanted to join him in death. She wanted to finally be together with him, and did not want to live alone without him. When Chi You first asked Ah Heng to promise to live to pass on his message to XY, she refused to make the promise. But Chi You begged her and Ah Heng couldn't bear to deny Chi You his last wish as he was dying, so she did end up making the promise for his sake. Very shortly after making the promise, Ah Heng felt that she wouldn't be able to keep it, until Chi You's heart and spirit comforted her and made her feel that he would be with her while she waited for XY. And as soon as she fulfilled her promise she joined Chi You in death.
-----
Once Promised Volume 2, Chapter 19:
Qi Yo had no heart anymore……he was dying!
Ah Heng stared at Qi Yo and gradually a peaceful smile came to her, she was going to be entwined with him in life or in death. She clung onto him with a smile, they were finally together and it didn’t matter whether they lived or died. Just like this, together forever, never apart. Just like this, until the end of time.
Qi Yo clung onto her and weakly said, “Remember what you said on Cao Yun Peak? You said that you wanted to see Xiao Yao and Zhuan Xu grow up and see that she got married and he took a wife. Remember I promised that I would make your wish come true? If you leave now then you will forever come to regret it and never be able to stop worrying about Xiao Yao. Don’t you want to see our daughter grow up and get married? Don’t you want to know what kind of man she marries?”
Ah Heng tried to argue back but Qi Yo shushed her lips with a smile. “I know I promised also that I will be with you every single day of your life.”
Ah Heng grabbed Qi Yo’s hand and nodded vigorously.
Qi Yo said, “History is always written by the victors. When Xiao Yao grows up she will only hear that her real father is a lawless ruthless killing machine of a devil monster who seduced her mother. She might come to hate me with all her heart, and maybe hate you as well. Ah Heng, can you tell our daughter that I love her very much? Tell her that her parents never did anything they should be ashamed about. Tell her not to feel shame because of us. I don’t have parents so I don’t want our daughter to also have no parents. I never did a single day’s duty as her dad so this is the only thing I can do for her and that is to keep her mother alive. To give her the opportunity to learn the truth about who her mom and dad really were like. To let her never live her life in shame and resentment.”
The tears fell from Ah Heng’s eyes as she shook her head. No, she didn’t want to stay alive all alone!
Qi Yo tenderly added, “I know it’s going to be very painful. But live on, for me and for our daughter! When the day arrives that you see our daughter all grown up, you will understand then why I made this choice today. You will feel then that all the pain was worth it. Can you promise me to live on?”
Ah Heng stared at Qi Yo and refused to promise. His body shook and he weakly implored, “Ah Heng, promise me!”
Qi Yo was wild and fearless his entire life and she had never seen him beg for anything like he was doing right now. She could not deny him so reluctantly nodded her head.
Qi Yo held Ah heng’s hand and put it on her chest to hear the heart beat. “I will forever be by your side and will wait for you to come find me. To tell me directly that our daughter is living a very happy life. You need to ask her to call out to the Heavens “Dad!” so that I can hear it clearly. I’ve never heard her call me dad……..” Qi Yo’s entire body went slack in Ah Heng’s arms. “I wonder what her voice will sound like when she calls me dad, probably the most beautiful sound in the entire world……..”
“Let’s go find Xiao Yao right now so you can hear her call you dad.” Ah Heng hurriedly got up and carried Qi Yo on her back.
...
Ah Heng cradled Qi Yo in her arms and screamed her pain. Qi Yo, why make me stay alive all alone to endure all of this? Now she wasn’t a goddess, wasn’t a demon, wasn’t a human, wasn’t a monster, she was a freak with nowhere to go.
Everyone died and I’m the only one alive, forced to carry such painful memories. I don’t think I can bear it long enough to see our daughter grow up. I want to come find you now.
The heart inside of her appeared to feel her sorrow and started to beat wildly. Qi Yo’s body started to vanish into a fog and transformed into a peach blossom forest surrounding Ah Heng.
Qi Yo, what are you trying to tell me?
Ah Heng closed her eyes and touched her chest and reached out her other hand. The falling peach blossom petals were like warm caresses as his heart beat warming inside of her. Ah Heng suddenly opened her eyes – you’re here, you’re really here forever by my side!
She murmured, “I understand. No matter how painful I will stay alive. For everyone who died, for Xiao Yao, and for you. I want to tell Xiao Yao myself how her dad was the greatest hero the world never knew it had.”
The earth churned around her as all the corpses were pulled into the ground and more and more peach blossom trees sprouted up around her. Ah Heng got up and turned towards the forest, Qi Yo is this the home you’ve made for me?
Then I will stay here with you forever, never to be apart again.
The bar is in hell with this character. It wouldn't be so bad if I didn't feel as if I'm expected to like him. If I have to make excuses over and over again to swallow your actions, then it's a sign that I truly don't like you. So, no I don't like this character :-). YMObviouslyV.
The funny thing is, despite all the time I spend sort of defending TSJ in this thread, most of the time I don't like him much either. I just don't dislike him as intensely as most of the participants in this thread, and I feel like he (like CX, who I also don't like most of the time) has his moments.
Presenting our Nine-headed Demon in his latest style, which my daughter maintains that this is his best look yet! While not exactly the pristine, not-a-hair-out-of-place image we have come to associate with our Nine-headed Demon, perhaps this is reflective of him, bedraggled and all, after going against the maelstrom in Chapter 43? Either way, don't tell her but I think he looks absolutely adorable in his troll look too!
liddi:
Presenting our Nine-headed Demon in his latest style, which my daughter maintains that this is his best look yet! While not exactly the pristine, not-a-hair-out-of-place image we have come to associate with our Nine-headed Demon, perhaps this is reflective of him, bedraggled and all, after going against the maelstrom in Chapter 43? Either way, don't tell her but I think he looks absolutely adorable in his troll look too!
he is so cute! I just ordered mine so I can't wait to meet Lord Xiang Liu. haha.
Presenting our Nine-headed Demon in his latest style, which my daughter maintains that this is his best look yet! While not exactly the pristine, not-a-hair-out-of-place image we have come to associate with our Nine-headed Demon, perhaps this is reflective of him, bedraggled and all, after going against the maelstrom in Chapter 43? Either way, don't tell her but I think he looks absolutely adorable in his troll look too!
That's now Jareth the Goblin King and I'm not complaining :D
plor20:
he is so cute! I just ordered mine so incnstnesit to see meet Lord Xiang Liu. haha.
I hope he arrives for you soon! He is adorable isn't he? And he gets even more so with each passing day, bad hair day or otherwise!
nathsketch:
That's now Jareth the Goblin King and I'm not complaining :D
You know, I never noticed until you mentioned it, but now that you did, I can't unsee it either. Jareth Xiang? Jareth Liu? Look! Jareth even has a crystal globe, like someone else we know:
cr. radiotimes.com
whom we can see holding here, in arguably one of my favourite Xiang Liu artwork, which captures the essence of this character so beautifully:
cr. zhihu.com
Presenting our Nine-headed Demon in his latest style, which my daughter maintains that this is his best look yet! While not exactly the pristine, not-a-hair-out-of-place image we have come to associate with our Nine-headed Demon, perhaps this is reflective of him, bedraggled and all, after going against the maelstrom in Chapter 43? Either way, don't tell her but I think he looks absolutely adorable in his troll look too!
Dear Lord! Did he walk too close to an electric socket :-)? Or did your daughter decide to play hairdresser with him? He looks like my poor Barbie that one time I decided to give her a haircut :-). He's still an adorable grumpy pants, though. I placed an order with that seller you gave me the link to. My own grumpy pants is crossing the ocean to me as we type!
he is so cute! I just ordered mine so incnstnesit to see meet Lord Xiang Liu. haha.
I put off buying him for ages, but finally gave in due to the cuteness! We'll have to do a reveal once our respective grumpy pants arrive :-)
a bonus point for her loyalty to XLblabla100:
That bonus point is just for readers. Did XL get any benefit or care out of her loyalty except suffering her long term sleeping problem, heartache and losing lives and strength to clean up her mess? I think the only reason that he delayed the moment of cutting their last bond - the bug until the end, just before his death because he could still detect, feel her longing for him via the bug. Awareness of her remained love also came with sensing of all her emotional feeling for other man. Yes, maybe he was describled like "alien" fairy guy who did not belong to the mortal life then he would not feel jealous when the woman he loved kissed passionately to other man and he could feel every single sensation of those kisses (which might be depicted on the drama). It was too unrealistic.
XY cared for loss an gain. From family point of view, XY mainly cared for CX because of their origin, their childhood memory and promise of taking care each other. She did not have strong connection with Ah Nian, yellow emperor even her "father". She did a lot for CX. On the other hand, XL also had his family and his responsibility. XL's family was his adoptive father, the soldiers that fought along him for century, such bond was sometimes stronger than brotherhood.
When someone takes you to see a slave fighting for his freedom în order for her to not give up hoping and fighting after Jing became clan leader, what was she supposed to think? That XL wants her? No one will think that, honestly.
When I watched the drama (before reading the novel and even after reading the novel I still keep the same impression), XL's reaction in the drama showed to me that what he said and Left Ear's win gave hope to XY but also to himself. Look at his face at that moment. And in general I don't interpret that he hoped XY to keep trusting on Jing. In my view, he wanted XY to believe in life in general. Why did XY have to tie her life to Jing? So narrow minded to restrict her life to Jing.
Same goes for the 37 years underwater, I personally would definetely think that, altough XL saved my life regardless of his reasons, he doesn't want me there anymore. He sent me back to my old life, he sent me back to Jing basically.
What had happened just before that 37 years? XL left for 6 months because of his business. What had XY done? Her relationship with Jing soared. Before, she spent a few days per week practising archery and going out with him and a few other days to hang out with Jing in Cao Ao Crest. However, he just left, she moved to Xiao Zhurong's residence and had all sorts of itimacy with Jing. He knew it (thank to the bug). So, he knew how important Jing was to XL.
He woke her up with drastic method and gave option for her to choose. He did not want her to feel indebted to him. It was already very awkward the first time when they saw each other in Jing's promotion event. If he showed up when she woke up, how should it be? Should he have said "no problem, I saved you because I wanted a mountain peak in Sheng Nong" ? And what did he get when she returned to Zhiyi? He probably knew how she treated Jing, how she fed medicine to Jing. And what was XY's feeling when CX told her that XL asked for the mountain in return of saving her? - A bit of disappointed but also relieved. She would take every opportunity or reason to discharge him (to be her lover).
I am not even going to mention the crystal ball, because with that she kinda paid whatever sins she had
It is her most obvious effort. However, it might be too late. Moreover, many of our posts about the crystal ball mentioned that the ball was half commitment message. If she did not love FL and didn't want to live with him, why didn't she cancel the marriage? She still proceeded to the wedding, sending her crystal ball with the message the last time making poison and "please kindly accept it"
Also, can someone who read once promised, tell me if her mom ever avoided getting married or buying herself time before tying the knots? Trying to figure out what did yellow emperor meant when he told XY that she is exactly like her mom when she postponed the wedding to Jing. For 43 years, can't help but mention it again.
She tried to meet Chi You before confirming the marriage. She wanted to run away with Chi You althought Chang Yi tried to stop her and explain to her the importance of the marrige to her mom and her brothers. She came to Baili, waited for him (they promised to meet each other in the spring festival). However, Chi You did not come. The reason is Yan Emperor died that day. Chi You had to return to Sheng Nong.
On her wedding, Chi You show up at the bridge at the border to Gao xin. He and Shao Hao had a fight in the fog created by Shao hao so that what happened was not visible to public. Chi You lost (if I remember correctly) Ah Heng told Chi You that it was too late then Chi You thew back the red robe that Ah Heng made for him. Ah Heng once told him that as long as he wore that red robe, she would come to see him in Baili.
However, right at the first night of her wedding, she already made alliance agreement with Shao Hao that she would help Shao Hao to get what he wanted (to be king) but he would not make her queen and she could get out of the marriage if she wanted. She kept working to find opportunity to meet and reunion with Chi You.
AH :
HeadInTheClouds:
As to your question about the other character choosing to die. A-Heng longed to die but didn't because she remembered her responsibility towards XY. This is different to what Jing did.
I don't agree with that characterization of why Ah Heng survived until she met XY instead of dying with Chi You.
When Chi You was dying, Ah Heng wanted to join him in death. She wanted to finally be together with him, and did not want to live alone without him. When Chi You first asked Ah Heng to promise to live to pass on his message to XY, she refused to make the promise. But Chi You begged her and Ah Heng couldn't bear to deny Chi You his last wish as he was dying, so she did end up making the promise for his sake. Very shortly after making the promise, Ah Heng felt that she wouldn't be able to keep it, until Chi You's heart and spirit comforted her and made her feel that he would be with her while she waited for XY. And as soon as she fulfilled her promise she joined Chi You in death.
I think @HeadInTheClouds means Ah-Heng longed to die and join Chi You during 400 years of living as a Drought Demon waiting for XY, not the moment right after the battle. Chi You wanted her to live and meet XY again.
"Choosing to hide" doesn't seem like an accurate description to me. His soul was seeking death, a permanent outcome if achieved, in order to be with XY, not to hide from something or someone.
His soul was seeking death because he thought XY was dead. As far as he was aware, that didn't change
I actually find his method of seeking death cowardice. Normal people when facing their loved one's death normally would pay proper farewel, funeral to make sure that the soul of ceased one would relieve and have better life when reincarnating (in the past people believed in afterlife, ceased people after death would be reborn). If he wanted to join XY why didn't he do it in active and decisive way? Why just he let the consciousness die slowly. Basically he could not face her death as normal way(as same level as CX did not believe XY's death). He was also afraid of that he did not have the gut to commit suicide because outside that special circumstance, responsibility with his family and clan could prevend him from doing so. CX's mom chose to join her husband but she waited until the funeral and tried to revenge for her husband before taking her own life away. At least she explained to CX the reason. Jing did not do it to his old grandmom.
HeadInTheClouds:
AH :
When it comes to fictional characters, living and dying for a romantic interest isn't something that I personally view as a black mark against the character.
XianXia dramas are of course filled with this trope. And because I knew what to expect, I parked my brain on a different continent and just went with it. However, the amount of times that I want to reach into the screen and throttle some characters for this "love brain" idiocy has been too numerous to count. Probably why, despite watching so many Cdramas, there are not that many characters that I can say that I genuinely love or dramas that have stuck with me. Unfortunately, since I'm choosing to look critically at LYF, then evaluating its characters will also be more critical.
Lol, HeadInTheClouds I have to admit I find the huge discrepancy between our preferences here amusing. ^^
I have seen many xianxia dramas and I have seen many characters who wanted to die or sacrifice for their love one. In most cases, the main lead choose to sacrifice for their loved one's sake of living or better future. In the case of the loved one passed away, some did something like CX's mother, some choose to continue living to fulfil certain common tasks/purpose or responsibility and they only die when completed their purpose (usually for other people, world peace etc). I have never seen a character like Jing especially as main character.
For example, in a recent drama Wonderland of love, when the female lead had no signal of life anymore, the doctor declared that she was dead; the male lead did not want to believe it, he brought her to their favourite place and did many things that he used to do for her to make her wake up. In the end he accepted the fact, carried her coffin along to fight agaist their enemy as the last time fighting alongside each other. Later, he told her when everying was over (she woke up during the battle) that he wanted to join her but he still carried the responsibility of bringing the country in peace and happy life for people (that both of them wanted), he said he planned to exist 10 more year until his cousin grew up and he could pass the country to his cousin then he would join her.
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