Season 2 had good moments but alas, also draggy ones if I compare to season 1.Now I watched many dramas of Hong…
Agree with this! While I didn't find it boring my first time through, there are parts I now skip on rewatchs (sorry, Maiden Kim and Park Jin, you guys are SO boring). Both seasons had plenty of draggy moments for me.
Rewatching definitely exposes the weak parts, plot holes, and incomplete world building, but there are (as you say) definitely strong parts that still make the whole thing worth it to watch.
But yes, definitely some unnecessary fluffy and filler! I also loved Go Young Jung. She kind of feels like a Korean version of Zhao Lusi (a very strong, versatile Chinese actress who is also fantastic!).
Rewatching this with my sis and, unexpectedly, I'm enjoying it more than my rewatch of Season 1. (I loved both…
For instance, Naksu (the assassin trained to kill) in Season 1 is tough, jaded, cold and brusque/brutal, protecting Jang Uk throughout the season in inflexible, harsh ways that is all she knows, while Jang Uk is relentless in his search for freedom to pursue his dream and desperate for someone to be on his side. He is optimistic, charming, sweet, deeply stubborn, and unable to be squashed.
They reverse these personas for the characters in Season 2.
Jang Uk becomes cold, jaded, cynical, and harsh after being romantically burned (due to being murdered by his fiance who ran wild...) and yet still "reluctantly" protects Naksu who is now innocent, charming and warm (due to her amnesia--the Naksu she would have been if she'd never been an assassin), desperate for someone to support her in becoming her own person (and using her wits and womanly charms as that's all she now has at her disposal) as her "mother" uses and misunderstands her just as Park Jin did with Uk in Season 1.
Naksu also has incredible power bubbling beneath the surface yet to be fully realized (since now she is joined with Bu Yeon and a kind of reincarnation of Jin Seol Ran), like Uk had in Season 1; Uk is the harbinger of the King's Star, which makes him a kind of reincarnation of Seo Gyeong, too. Seol Ran and Seo Gyeong were lovers, just as Naksu and Uk are.
In Season 1, Naksu was Jang Uk's hope, in Season 2, Jang Uk is Naksu's hope.
The only added element in Season 2 is that Uk subconsciously senses who Naksu is, and falls in love with her again without fully realizing that she's only ever been the same person. It takes him quite a while to figure it out, though!
And while the ending conflict was a bit anti-climactic as far as plot resolution, I loved the way the story ended for our Ukkie and Mu Doekkie; loved the last episode and final scene. ☺️
Random Side Note: Did you notice our FL has FOUR names when all is said and done? 1. Naksu, 2. Jin Bu Yeon, 3. Mu Doek, and 4. Cho Yeong. I'm glad she chose Cho Yeong as her final name to go by. 🥰
Rewatching this with my sis and, unexpectedly, I'm enjoying it more than my rewatch of Season 1. (I loved both seasons on my first watch) Go Youn Jung is just so endearing and adorable!
Even more than before I notice the roles and characters of Naksu and Jang Uk being swapped in the seasons. I like it, and enough justification is given for the change in behavior and roles (in my opinion, at least). I know some people hated this, but it really worked for me!
Look for it, you'll see the way they flip flop in personality and demeanor and in how they relate to each other.
The first half was actually the best part of the drama. The second half is where it clearly starts spiraling downwards.…
I agree with what the reviewer I said "nailed it" wrote, but I'd mainly say that I didn't care for Amogae and his story (I thought he was kind of boring and too gray to root for), and I didn't like wishie-washie Gil Dong who was just out for profit and floating around aimlessly. I liked the second half because I thought the romance was sweet (you haven't gotten to much of that part yet) and I enjoyed seeing Gil Dong become honorable and fight for the people. I always thought of Mori as a foil to Gil Dong, and that's why I liked his arc because Gil Dong inspired him to let go of his bitterness and make different choices. I did think the stuff they incorporated about him being super strong later on was random, but I have yet to watch a sageuk where everything that happened made 100% sense and fit together without plot holes or loose threads (except maybe Under The Queen's Umbrella). This drama is no exception. I loved it despite it's flaws because I like character growth and close friendship/familial bonds. Did that provide you a taste of my reasoning? I could say more, but it seems you've already made up your mind. 🤷♀️
So yeah, the second half is the part I rewatch and the part I enjoyed most. Besides, Episode 18 is just starting the second half. I'm not quite sure how you can confidently say you think the 2nd half was worse when you haven't finished it yet? 🤔
Ah, I loved her in that one. 😅 It's a ridiculous premise/plot but still loved it. The lying went on too long, though. She's also super cute (in my opinion) in Rebel: Thief Who Stole The People.
Do you know when this drama gets better cause im on ep 4 find it boring for some reason. Do you know what episode…
Well... I would say it's good from the start, but it has a "slow" plot, in the sense that a lot of the movement of the story is driven forward by small, subtle movements of MCS's strategizing from the shadows, and the friendship he grows (again) with Jingyan (aka Prince Jing, the beautiful one 😆). The majority of scenes are characters talking to each other, and some people might find that "boring" if they're not tracking with the substance of their conversation.
It's essentially, from Episode 1, an elaborate, careful plan by Chang Su to get justice for his family and friends, and how his intricate plan unfolds AND how he pivots to make his plan work even as new, unexpected factors and challenges arise (I will give one small, spoiler-y detail to illustrate what the story manages to show by the end: at one point all the characters around Chang Su that would never dream of treason in the traditional sense of overthrowing the Emperor by force, are ready, IN A HEARTBEAT, to stage a coup against the Emperor because of the barest hint sickly, quiet, gentle Chang Su might be in danger. Why would they do this? If you watch the drama through to the end, you'll have your answer 😏).
I got invested in the characters I grew to love getting the justice they deserved, and that's also what kept me going. Somehow the characters you root for work within the parameters of their own roles (and stay in their lane) while undermining the Emperor and his power at the same time. Chang Su slowly and methodically declaws all of his opponents (the villains), just by thinking, planning and prioritizing people and the truth. 😍
I didn't ever find it boring, but there were parts that felt less "gripping" to watch, as the story is doing a lot of showing and not telling. Everything started coming together for me (I would say this is when I got fully hooked) around Episode 30 or so. If you keep watching for a bit more and still find it boring, it might be too hard to make it that far.
In order to like this drama I think you have to be able to track the intricate political/calculative motivations and plotting of all the various characters, and if you don't usually like that stuff, this might be tough to watch. I don't usually like that stuff myself (most of my exposure to this is in Kdramas, and their politicking doesn't hold a candle to this show as I almost always find ut boring in sageuks!), but I found it interesting here because it was clear to me how necessary all of it was; none of it felt like a side plot or superfluous.
Honestly, watching this felt a bit like reading Homer's Iliad. Sometimes events in that story (the endless battles and "side plots") seem unrelated to Achilles' rage (who only shows up in a 1/3 of the epic), but it all still feeds into and builds up to resolve and showcase the main arc (and the consequences of Achilles' decision) in masterful, necessary ways if you look closely.
So, it might seem like all these arcs can stand alone in NIF or are separate and unrelated, but they all feed into and build to a climax and resolution. If you can try to connect things to that larger arc as you watch, I think that could help? Trust the first half builds characters and relationships and is giving you a taste of who everyone is, and why WE should care about them or not and how/why they come to care for each other. It lays the foundation for resolution. The second half then just builds on all of the first half and wraps everything up in such a beautiful, poignant way.
There's little spectacle and does not rely on shocking, sordid or dramatic plot twists to keep the story moving. There are reveals but they unfold organically as the story progresses.
I don't know if that helped! I don't think it's for everyone, though, so, if nothing else I hope it helped you determine where you probably land. 😅
To me it is one of best k-dramas I have ever watched.
A classic, hands down, and introduced many, many people (me included) to Asian entertainment. This got me into Kdramas, which slowly got me into Cdramas (because I feel like Kdramas are struggling as of late, or more and more available on platforms I don't have access to/want to pay for). All because of CLOY; it got me hooked!
if any indian movie industry remakes it, it will be quite good. i mean they can crash land on Pakistan or India…
Do Pakistan and India have the same dynamic as North and South Korea, though? 🤔
But a U.S. remake does sound silly. 😅 Nothing can match the stakes/factors involved. It's like how a chaebol plot for an American show can't work either. We don't have the social structure anywhere in society to justify such a plot, nor would we have the arranged marriages and such. No one would buy it. Some stories don't work in all cultures/countries. 😅
Maybe Albania and Serbia? 🤔
It just wouldn't work unless you can justify somewhat "demonizing" the other side, too. Most people in the western world look at North Korea as dominated by a tyrannical government. So, while CLOY humanized individuals in North Korea, it didn't have to walk on eggshells when portraying the North Korean government as... less than stellar and upstanding, because no one with access to the show would throw a fit.
god i was so prepared to hate this show because his grown ass meeting teenage sang zhi and the brother sister…
Yeah, I think they made a mistake in not casting a different ML for his "younger" self or not having a slightly older looking FL when she was young (the young actress just loked super young). 13 year olds can look very young, though! I think the really important thing that keeps this from actually entering creepy territory is that he never considers her in a romantic light until she's an adult, so while she was crushing hard on him as a young girl, he wasn't until much later. The casting made it harder to not get hung up, though, for sure!
I love rewatching the episodes where he investigates whether he's her crush and flirts with her hardcore. Both actors absolutely delivered in these scenes! Their chemistry and the way he continually makes her flustered and surprised and fluttery was just the best. It was so fun to watch him torment her! 😅 Some of the best romantic moments in a drama I've ever seen.
Rewatching definitely exposes the weak parts, plot holes, and incomplete world building, but there are (as you say) definitely strong parts that still make the whole thing worth it to watch.
But yes, definitely some unnecessary fluffy and filler! I also loved Go Young Jung. She kind of feels like a Korean version of Zhao Lusi (a very strong, versatile Chinese actress who is also fantastic!).
They reverse these personas for the characters in Season 2.
Jang Uk becomes cold, jaded, cynical, and harsh after being romantically burned (due to being murdered by his fiance who ran wild...) and yet still "reluctantly" protects Naksu who is now innocent, charming and warm (due to her amnesia--the Naksu she would have been if she'd never been an assassin), desperate for someone to support her in becoming her own person (and using her wits and womanly charms as that's all she now has at her disposal) as her "mother" uses and misunderstands her just as Park Jin did with Uk in Season 1.
Naksu also has incredible power bubbling beneath the surface yet to be fully realized (since now she is joined with Bu Yeon and a kind of reincarnation of Jin Seol Ran), like Uk had in Season 1; Uk is the harbinger of the King's Star, which makes him a kind of reincarnation of Seo Gyeong, too. Seol Ran and Seo Gyeong were lovers, just as Naksu and Uk are.
In Season 1, Naksu was Jang Uk's hope, in Season 2, Jang Uk is Naksu's hope.
The only added element in Season 2 is that Uk subconsciously senses who Naksu is, and falls in love with her again without fully realizing that she's only ever been the same person. It takes him quite a while to figure it out, though!
And while the ending conflict was a bit anti-climactic as far as plot resolution, I loved the way the story ended for our Ukkie and Mu Doekkie; loved the last episode and final scene. ☺️
Random Side Note: Did you notice our FL has FOUR names when all is said and done? 1. Naksu, 2. Jin Bu Yeon, 3. Mu Doek, and 4. Cho Yeong. I'm glad she chose Cho Yeong as her final name to go by. 🥰
Even more than before I notice the roles and characters of Naksu and Jang Uk being swapped in the seasons. I like it, and enough justification is given for the change in behavior and roles (in my opinion, at least). I know some people hated this, but it really worked for me!
Look for it, you'll see the way they flip flop in personality and demeanor and in how they relate to each other.
So yeah, the second half is the part I rewatch and the part I enjoyed most. Besides, Episode 18 is just starting the second half. I'm not quite sure how you can confidently say you think the 2nd half was worse when you haven't finished it yet? 🤔
It's essentially, from Episode 1, an elaborate, careful plan by Chang Su to get justice for his family and friends, and how his intricate plan unfolds AND how he pivots to make his plan work even as new, unexpected factors and challenges arise (I will give one small, spoiler-y detail to illustrate what the story manages to show by the end: at one point all the characters around Chang Su that would never dream of treason in the traditional sense of overthrowing the Emperor by force, are ready, IN A HEARTBEAT, to stage a coup against the Emperor because of the barest hint sickly, quiet, gentle Chang Su might be in danger. Why would they do this? If you watch the drama through to the end, you'll have your answer 😏).
I got invested in the characters I grew to love getting the justice they deserved, and that's also what kept me going. Somehow the characters you root for work within the parameters of their own roles (and stay in their lane) while undermining the Emperor and his power at the same time. Chang Su slowly and methodically declaws all of his opponents (the villains), just by thinking, planning and prioritizing people and the truth. 😍
I didn't ever find it boring, but there were parts that felt less "gripping" to watch, as the story is doing a lot of showing and not telling. Everything started coming together for me (I would say this is when I got fully hooked) around Episode 30 or so. If you keep watching for a bit more and still find it boring, it might be too hard to make it that far.
In order to like this drama I think you have to be able to track the intricate political/calculative motivations and plotting of all the various characters, and if you don't usually like that stuff, this might be tough to watch. I don't usually like that stuff myself (most of my exposure to this is in Kdramas, and their politicking doesn't hold a candle to this show as I almost always find ut boring in sageuks!), but I found it interesting here because it was clear to me how necessary all of it was; none of it felt like a side plot or superfluous.
Honestly, watching this felt a bit like reading Homer's Iliad. Sometimes events in that story (the endless battles and "side plots") seem unrelated to Achilles' rage (who only shows up in a 1/3 of the epic), but it all still feeds into and builds up to resolve and showcase the main arc (and the consequences of Achilles' decision) in masterful, necessary ways if you look closely.
So, it might seem like all these arcs can stand alone in NIF or are separate and unrelated, but they all feed into and build to a climax and resolution. If you can try to connect things to that larger arc as you watch, I think that could help? Trust the first half builds characters and relationships and is giving you a taste of who everyone is, and why WE should care about them or not and how/why they come to care for each other. It lays the foundation for resolution. The second half then just builds on all of the first half and wraps everything up in such a beautiful, poignant way.
There's little spectacle and does not rely on shocking, sordid or dramatic plot twists to keep the story moving. There are reveals but they unfold organically as the story progresses.
I don't know if that helped! I don't think it's for everyone, though, so, if nothing else I hope it helped you determine where you probably land. 😅
Hard pass!
But a U.S. remake does sound silly. 😅 Nothing can match the stakes/factors involved. It's like how a chaebol plot for an American show can't work either. We don't have the social structure anywhere in society to justify such a plot, nor would we have the arranged marriages and such. No one would buy it. Some stories don't work in all cultures/countries. 😅
Maybe Albania and Serbia? 🤔
It just wouldn't work unless you can justify somewhat "demonizing" the other side, too. Most people in the western world look at North Korea as dominated by a tyrannical government. So, while CLOY humanized individuals in North Korea, it didn't have to walk on eggshells when portraying the North Korean government as... less than stellar and upstanding, because no one with access to the show would throw a fit.
Certainly a difficult drama to adapt!
I love rewatching the episodes where he investigates whether he's her crush and flirts with her hardcore. Both actors absolutely delivered in these scenes! Their chemistry and the way he continually makes her flustered and surprised and fluttery was just the best. It was so fun to watch him torment her! 😅 Some of the best romantic moments in a drama I've ever seen.