Xiang Liu and Xiao Yao’s Story and Romance

 solarlunareclipse:

I'm not sure I understand. I thought XY was telling her story about Jing one night after the full moon/wedding night, not two nights after. Can you point me to the text that indicates she's telling her story 2 nights after?

The planned wedding night was full moon and XY vowed to the moon to be Jing wife. After that she got the message and she and Miao Pu went to the sea where she met the albatross demon during the day. Thus that day was 1 day after fullmoon night.

Then she was buried in the crystal coffin which was driven to the vortex at night. XL saved her and they landed to an island where he took her blood and then cooked for her. It was 1 night after fullmoon. 

After that they searched for the boat with Miao Fu, Left Ear and the albatross demon and encountered it during the day. Thus it was the 2nd day after full moon. At night XL and XY had the discussion and he said sth like she was idiot and wanted to undo the poison lovers'bug between them. And XY distracted the topic by her story about Jing and looking at moon and sang the song which XL heard on the first time they met. So, the night she sang to the moon in front of XL was 2 nights after the fullmoon. 

Note: In Vietnam, we also use lunar calendar which almost identical with Chinese lunar calendar. There are some 29-day-months and some 30-day-months. Traditionally, the fullmoon day is the 15th day of the month regardless how many days of the month. On 15th day of the month, there is religious custom to pray for the the anchestor. We don't do it on 16th day. In term of physical appearance of the moon, the roundness of moon in the evening of 15th day or 16th day  are almost identical. Sometimes the moon looks rounder on 16th day but definition of fullmoon day is always 15th day.  Therefore, according to this calculation, XY vowed to the moon to marry Jing was evening/night of 15th day. XL saved her on 16th night and she sang on the boat on 17th night. The night when she last met Jing was 32 days ago which was also 15th day, fullmoon day as generally speaking of 30-day-month

@H19279

"sang the song which XL heard on the first time they met."

 The song she sang, the crystal ball she sent, so similar to the pursue of the merpeople. Too bad that the one who responding to her song was the fisherman and not the merman. 

Dear all,

I was very busy yesterday with moving to new house, and just within 10 hours I saw notification of 24 then 30 unread posts. Wow, so crowded!

@liddi, @solarlunareclipse & @Blabla100

With regard to the night when XY looked at the moon after the news of XL's death was confirmed I am with @solarlunareclipse. Base on the calculation that @Windiaaa did carefully, their wedding was at the end of the month. A few days later, XY heard the news when new month came and there was new moon but it should be crescent shape. In the past I also tracked the novel for the date of each event when I read @Windiaaa'  s post about the date of their wedding. And only that day I realized that XY had been staying inside the blood spelled Shell for 1 month in the water of Jade Mountain. (EDIT: I managed to find my post at that time. Here is the link: https://br.mydramalist.com/discussions/lost-you-forever/110123-xl-and-xy-story-and-romance-warning-spoilers?pid=2855377&page=325#p2855377 )

I also checked the vietnamese translation, it said it was a bright moonlight night. It did not say fullmoon when she got out the palace and looked at the moon. In my opinion, if the word may have various meaning or interpretation, we should look at other evidence to consult the definite meaning. If I remember correctly, XY looked at a bright moon and wonder when XL died if the moon also shone on him. It is not necessary to be a special full moon. Moreover, their special date was on a full moon, going from Gourd lake  to the sea and when XY saw him the last time, she shoot him and said she didn't want to see him anymore was also a full-moon on Gourd lake. Love started and ended at the same spot.

I am NOT proficient in Mandarin and use dictionary to check the meaning of words. According to Hanbook dictionary, the word  轮 means wheel,  disc, ring etc and they also give example of fullmoon = 月 轮 (so the word [yue] stands in front of the word [lu'n]). 

I remembered that around the time of Windiaa about the wedding night, I wrote a short post about the moon when XL saved XY in jade mountain. It was also a full moon (that was why I realized that it was 1 month after her suicide). When XY committed suicide, Tong Hua used the word 月 圆  to indicate that it was a full moon night. XL came to Jade mountain also on a full moon TH used the word "满月". Both words mean full moon and if we combine the adjective to make 圆 满 which means satisfactory. And I remember TJC used this word in his interview about the ending of XL. The moment when he finished the process of removing the lovers'bug, cutting the last connection between him and XY, he had already saved and woken Jing. His mission with XY was completed and he could accomplish his duty with the remanant army without worrying of XY's future.

According to Hanbook dictionary 

• "圆满" expresses perfection and thoroughness, which means that the development of things fully meets people's expectations, and is mostly used in meetings, events, etc.

After re-reading my previous post about the moon when XL saved XY in jade mountain, I'd like to add some thought about the debate of "一轮". In chapter 48, TH used the phrase "一轮满月"

一轮满月，悬挂在黛色的天空，清辉静静洒下，瑶池上水波荡漾，银光点点，相柳犹如一条鱼儿无声无息的没入瑶池，波光乍开，人影已逝，只几圈涟漪缓缓荡开。(chapter 48, edition 2013)

The meaning of 一轮 here is to indicate another time/round of full moon. And base on the calculation, the night XY heard XL's death was on the beginning days of the month, thus it also means another round of the moon cycle 

 H19279:

I am proficient in Mandarin and use dictionary to check the meaning of words. According to Hanbook dictionary, the word  轮 means wheel,  disc, ring etc and they also give example of fullmoon = 月 轮 (so the word [yue] stands in front of the word [lu'n]). 

I honestly don't want to rehash this as it had been beaten to death yesterday, and discussions in the middle of the night are rarely conducive to any lucid discourse. Nonetheless, I will say this. 

I may be wrong, but my impression was that @solarlunareclipse's contention it was not a full moon was because she was sure Xiao Yao married on the day of a waxing crescent moon. Since she initially thought Xiao Yao learnt of Xiang Liu's death the day after the wedding, she cannot accept that Xiao Yao saw a full moon that night, because it would mean Xiao Yao got married on a full moon day. Nonetheless, as pointed out, no one is denying that Xiao Yao married on a waxing crescent moon day. The point is Xiao Yao only learnt of Xiang Liu's passing several days after her wedding, after Sir Bi and Lie Yang finally left for Jade Mountain. So there was no way whatever moon she saw was similar to the one on the day she got married. 

一轮 is used to describe something that is round.

Contrast this to the scene when Xiao Yao was singing to Jing at the sea. The novel specifically mentions that it was already past the full moon day, but if one did not look closely, the moon still seemed to be round even though it was no longer so. There is no use of 一轮 to describe the moon in that scene.

The term 一轮 is only used 5 times in the novel. If we were to be pedantic since there is contention on what it actually means, it can be translated as "round" unless specifically mentioned:

1. When Xiao Yao and Xiang Liu looked at the moon hand in hand and he told her life was precious as long as such sights existed:

没有多久，一轮明月，缓缓从海面升起，清辉倾泻而下，小六被天地瑰丽震撼，心上的硬壳都柔软了。
Not long after that, a bright round moon slowly rose from the surface of the ocean, clear, bright moonlight shining down. Stunned by the breathtaking sight, the hard shell around Xiao Liu’s heart softened.
-- Vol 1 Ch4

2. After finding out about the lovers bug in Bai Li, and choosing to stay one extra night on the ship:

微风习习，一轮明亮的圆月悬挂在天上，海面波光粼粼，十分静谧美丽。
There was a gentle breeze. A bright full moon hung in the sky, while the waves on the surface of the ocean shimmered, very tranquil and beautiful.
-- Vol 3 Ch4  (Chapter 37)

3. When Xiang Liu went to save her and wake her up at Jade Mountain:

一轮满月，悬挂在黛色的天空，清辉静静洒下，瑶池上水波荡漾，银光点点。相柳犹如一条鱼儿般无声无息地没入瑶池，波光乍开，人影已逝，只几圈涟漪缓缓荡开。
A full moon hung in the dark sky, casting down a clear light. The water on Jade Lake rippled, dotted with silver lights. Xiang Liu disappeared silently into Jade Lake like a fish. As the ripples spread, his figure had vanished, leaving only a few ripples slowly moving outwards.
-- Vol 3 Ch15  (Chapter 48)

4. Xiao Yao staring at the reflection of the moon the night before she was to be the new Royal Mother:

小夭一身素净的白衣，头发松松绾起，双脚悬空，坐在水榭的栏杆上，呆呆望着碧波中倒映的一轮月影。
Xiao Yao was dressed in pure white, her hair loosely tied up, her feet dangling as she sat on the railing of the waterside pavilion, staring blankly at the reflection of the round moon on the blue-green waves.
-- Vol 3 Ch16  (Chapter 49)

5. Staring at the moon the night she found out about Xiang Liu's death:

宫墙外，一轮皓月，冷冷清清。
Outside the palace walls, a bright round moon hung in the sky, cold and desolate.
-- Vol 3 Ch18  (Chapter 51)

Nonetheless, do note the saying "一轮皓月 玉宇无尘" is a couplet commonly used during Mid-Autumn festival (the time of the full moon), to describe a starless clear sky with only the bright moon hanging in the sky.

As such, I still believe that it was very likely a full moon night when she reminisced about Xiang Liu after his death.

 H19279:

EDIT:
After re-reading my previous post about the moon when XL saved XY in jade mountain, I'd like to add some thought about the debate of "一轮". In chapter 48, TH used the phrase "一轮满月"

一轮满月，悬挂在黛色的天空，清辉静静洒下，瑶池上水波荡漾，银光点点，相柳犹如一条鱼儿无声无息的没入瑶池，波光乍开，人影已逝，只几圈涟漪缓缓荡开。(chapter 48, edition 2013)

The meaning of 一轮 here is to indicate another time/round of full moon. And base on the calculation, the night XY heard XL's death was on the beginning days of the month, thus it also means another round of the moon cycle 

While 一轮 can refer to a cycle / round of occurrence, it is used as a descriptor for the moon that is round. As such, a cycle is not the meaning of the text "一轮满月“ within the context of the excerpt. Here, 一轮满月 literally means a (round) full moon.  

What term did TH use when she described the healing that went on every month during the 37 years? 

I personally find this debate quite interesting, but I am mostly disappointed that Jing and XY had a full moon night after all. 

@solarlunareclipse

Thank you! Again, what personally bothers me the most is the full moon that YaoJing got, till yesterday I thought the full moon is something that only YaoLiu got to experience. I try to draw a line between XY's feelings before and after chapter 32, because I believe it's only after that XY developed deeper feelings for jing, but a full moon? I don't know how to feel about that. 

 solarlunareclipse:

In the text, there are only four passages that mention the full moon (满月) with certainty.

The usage of 满月 in most of your examples describe the day or night of the full moon. It is not a description of the moon itself. Hence there is no use of 一轮 there. The only time the full moon is described in your example, it uses the quantifier 一轮满月. As I mentioned in an earlier post, 一轮 is a quantifier used to describe the moon (ref. 词典网 explanation #3 for examples when it is used in describing the moon that is round). Also, the use of 一轮皓月 commonly used in couplets to describe a Mid-autumn moon.

 solarlunareclipse:

I've already laid out my arguments that "一轮" is only meant to be interpreted as measure words and cannot be reliably used to infer the shape of the moon. Even if we consider "轮" to carry a connotation of round, a round moon does not necessarily mean a true full moon.

I would disagree that 一轮 does not infer the shape of the moon. Just as @plor20 mentioned, if it were a crescent moon, there would be no use of the word 一轮 to describe it. As such, 一轮 implies that it is round. What I do agree with you is that a round moon does not necessarily mean a true full moon. So if we were to be pedantic, then yes, it can be described as the round bright moon, as opposed to the bright full moon. 

I just question whether the moon Xiao Yao saw was just round or a full moon, because Tong Hua specifically mentioned that the moon was not exactly round even though it seemed that way when Xiao Yao sang to Jing. Yet in this case, she clearly related it back to the moon that Xiao Yao and Xiang Liu gazed upon in the past.

Anyway, I will stop here. I can only share what I know of the language. It is fine if you do not share the same opinion. We are all free to have our own interpretations. Who would have thought that a single word would result in a discussion lasting two days!