Love reading you, guys. Very interesting points, altough I still belive that it was XL who always rejected her. 

@windiaaa,  I know that you once posted a very interesting article about chapter 29, something about the masks they were wearing, do you happen to have it? I can't find it at all. 


新疆网讯(记者杨梦瑶)本月,言情作家桐华的最新长篇小说《长相思》由博集天卷文化公司策划出版。同时,小说版权也已卖给某影视公司将被搬上荧屏,成为继《步步惊心》《最美的时光》《大漠谣》和《云中歌》之后,桐华又一部“触电”作品。而《长相思》的第二部也将于5月推出。

与《步步惊心》中,若曦与四爷“相爱却不能相守”的感情故事殊途同归,桐华在新作中又写了一个“爱而不得”的故事,继续她标签式的爱情“虐心”。3月25日,本网记者邮件采访了定居美国的桐华。


Xinjiang Net News (Reporter Yang Mengyao) This month, romance writer Tong Hua's latest novel "Lost You Forever(LYF)" was planned and published by Boji Tianjuan Culture Company. At the same time, the copyright of the novel has been sold to a film and television company and will be put on the screen. It will become another "electric shock" for Tonghua after "Step by Step", "The Most Beautiful Time", "The Ballad of the Desert" and "Song in the Clouds" work. The second part of "Lost You Forever (LYF)" will also be released in May.

Similar to the emotional story of Ruoxi and the fourth master who "love each other but can't stay together" in "Bu Bu Jing Xin", Tong Hua wrote another story of "love but can't stay" in her new work, continuing her label-style love " Heartbreaking." On March 25, our reporter conducted an email interview with Tong Hua, who lives in the United States.

 blabla100:

Love reading you, guys. Very interesting points, altough I still belive that it was XL who always rejected her. 

@windiaaa,  I know that you once posted a very interesting article about chapter 29, something about the masks they were wearing, do you happen to have it? I can't find it at all. 

I read too many articles, I forgot which one.

 windiaaa041293:
Xinjiang Net News (Reporter Yang Mengyao) This month, romance writer Tong Hua's latest novel "Sauvignon Blanc" was planned and published by Boji Tianjuan Culture Company. At the same time, the copyright of the novel has been sold to a film and television company and will be put on the screen. It will become another "electric shock" for Tonghua after "Step by Step", "The Most Beautiful Time", "The Ballad of the Desert" and "Song in the Clouds" work. The second part of "Sauvignon Blanc" will also be released in May.

Thank you for your information. 

It would be great if  you can in future manually correct the automatic google translate's mistake that translates " 长相思 " as "Sauvignon blanc" (the name of a grape plant). We can either use its official English name- Lost you forever (LYF) or Eternal lovesickness (literal meaning of the book title)

 H19279:

Thank you for your information. 

It would be great if  you can in future manually correct the automatic google translate's mistake that translates " 长相思 " as "Sauvignon blanc" (the name of a grape plant). We can either use its official English name- Lost you forever (LYF) or Eternal lovesickness (literal meaning of the book title)

Ok.^^

 H19279:
And she has awareness of what was going on in the pool between her and XL. Since that point (or officially in chapter 6, just after embracing Jing) she started saying she was “scared” of XL..

This reminded me of something that blahblah100 asked a while ago in this post here https://mydramalist.com/discussions/lost-you-forever/110123-xl-and-xy-story-and-romance-warning-spoilers?pid=2871519&page=369#p2871519

about Xiao Yao's being scared around Fang Feng Bei. One explanation is the obvious one, that she's scared that he would drink her blood. However, except for the first time when XL surprised her, I don't think WXL/XY was ever really afraid of the blood-drinking. The second explanation is that following her reaction to the blood-drinking in the hot spring, XY was fearful of Xiang Liu drinking her blood because it would potentially lead to another "reaction" and potential loss of control. XY is fearful of letting Xiang Liu into her heart, so she would avoid this at all costs. 

Her instinctive reaction to FFB also suggests that deep down, she is aware that he's XL, she just didn't want to remove that "gauzy veil" that allowed them to spend time together without the barrier of opposing interests.

@windiaaa

Sauvignon Blanc|Under what circumstances did Xiaoyao make the ice crystal ball?


"Sauvignon Blanc" 2-12 <The smoke and water are vast, the meaning is unforgettable>


Chapter 12 of the second book of "Sauvignon Blanc", "Smoke and water, unforgettable thoughts", hits me every time.

 

Where is the old friend? The smoke and water are vast. I miss you so much, but I don’t know who to tell.

It's unforgettable, but everything in the past is too profound for me to forget.

 

"Xiao Yao was silent for more and more time, and Xinyue and An Nian didn't pay attention. In their impression, Xiao Yao was a lazy, unsociable, and aloof person. They didn't know that Xiao Yao was actually the most cold-blooded person. I'm afraid of loneliness and like to talk."

 

When I went out to buy something, I met Jing and felt uncomfortable:

 

"She has always told herself that losing a man is nothing, and she can still live a good life. She has always relied on her will to control everything very well, but at this moment, the emotions accumulated in her chest and abdomen suddenly lost control. .”

"When he sat down in front of the gaming table and revealed his emotions, anger and sadness without concealing it, Xiaoyao suddenly admired the person who opened this casino. He put on a mask and dared to express emotions that he usually did not dare to expose. "

 

Are those accumulated emotions just caused by Jing? no.

The emotions caused by Jing were already revealed when she didn't put on the mask. Her eyes were sore and she just wanted to stay away.

After putting on the mask, the emotions that you dare not expose can be revealed, only the emotions towards Xiang Liu.

 

"Xiaoyao has been winning money non-stop, betting bigger and bigger, and there is no limit. She is looking forward to causing some trouble . In Huangdi's words, she will indulge herself. But the casino is also strange, Xiaoyao has been No one tried to stop her from winning money. Later, people who gambled around gathered around Xiaoyao, followed her to place bets, and won money with Xiaoyao."

 

What does Xiaoyao expect to cause trouble? The clearest connection between Xiaoyao and the underground casino is Xiang Liu. Her actions are very much like she hopes to make a big fuss, see if Xiang Liu is there, and attract Xiang Liu.

Sure enough, Xiang Liu came, Xiao Yao stared at him, a little angry, you just came, stopped playing, and lost all the money.

 

" Xiaoyao said: "You know I'm engaged? "

"It's hard not to know about such a sensational thing! Oh, I forgot to say congratulations. Congratulations!"

Xiaoyao looked at Fangfeng Bei quietly for a moment , then shook his head and smiled: "There are two things I want to discuss with you."

Fangfeng Bei Tou played with his mask: "Say."

"The first is to make poison for you. I can still do it for you now, but... after I get married, I will no longer help you make poison. "

Fangfeng Bei caught the mask and looked at Xiaoyao with a smile: "What about the second thing?"

"I want to get rid of the voodoo between you and me. The Tushan family's wife had a witch doctor from the Jiuli tribe when she was alive. The witch doctor said... our vood seems to be the legendary lover's voodoo. As the name suggests, this voodoo is a lover . It's just time... you and I really... don't get along! " Xiaoyao laughed self-deprecatingly, "You were very tired of this Gu last time, so I thought... when you are free, could you please go to Jiujiu with me? Li, ask the Witch King to get rid of the poison."

Fangfeng Bei stared at Xiaoyao. Under the dim lights of the casino, the smile on his lips showed a hint of coldness.

Xiao Yao said: "Even if the poison is removed, my previous promise is still valid."

Fangfeng Bei said calmly: "Okay, wait until I have time."

The two walked out of the corridor in silence . Xiaoyao returned the mask to the waiter, and walked out of the dark room with Fangfeng Bei one after another. "

 

This is one of my three favorite descriptions in the whole book, but Xiaoyao’s self-deprecation, questioning and sadness are everywhere in the words:

 

You know that I'm going to marry Honglong, but you still congratulate me. Don't you have the heart?

When I heard that what we were growing was lover's poison, I laughed at myself and said it was irrelevant, but you just acquiesced?

I propose not to use poison and remove the poison, and to cut off the connection between us. Do you accept this?

 

"On the street, the moon has already shone on the willow branches and the lanterns have begun to shine.

Xiao Yaoqiang smiled and said to Fangfeng Bei: "I will deliver the poison every three months. I'm leaving."

Fangfeng Bei grabbed Xiaoyao's arm. Xiaoyao didn't look back, nor did she break away from his hand. She just tensed her body and waited quietly.

After a while, Fangfeng Bei said, "Come have dinner with me."

Xiaoyao's body collapsed , she shook her head with a smile and refused: "I don't have time!"

 

Xiang Liu subconsciously held on to her and didn't want her to leave, but rationally told him that he couldn't keep her and could only strive for more time for the two of them to spend time together. But Xiaoyao felt sad in her heart: I was waiting for you to keep me, waiting for you to tell me not to marry, but you just asked me to accompany you to dinner.

 

In old man Li Rong’s tavern:

 

"Li Rongchang said: "If you don't like the mother and son in Qingqiu, the worst possible outcome is to settle down in Zhiyi and let Jing live with you in Zhiyi forever. Let me tell you the truth, Fangfeng Bei's days are like today and tomorrow , even if Jing made a mistake, he is better than Fang Feng Bei..."

Xiaoyao banged the wine bowl heavily on the table, stared at Li Rongchang and said, "I'm engaged, and my fiancé is not him, so - please, please, please, don't keep stepping on others! "

 

Xiaoyao was angry because of what Li Rongchang said about Xiang Liu, but Xiang Liu reminded her that "he is not a man suitable for women to be with" and said, "don't you know that too?" - A man who is not suitable for women is never a man. Not Fangfengbei, but Xiangliu.

One sentence left Xiaoyao speechless. This was what she had in mind when she refused to kiss Xiang Liu Duqi. It was precisely because she knew it that she kept telling herself not to love him or expect to be with him. But why do you still unconsciously look forward to and get closer when you know it clearly?

 

"Li Rongchang felt relieved and listened to the murmurs coming from the house. He looked a little sad and sighed: "My uncle is not a bad person, but a very good person, so...he can't forget it "

Xiaoyao suddenly realized that what Li Rongchang had been talking about just now was actually Xiangliu. Did he know that Fangfengbei was Xiangliu? !

Na Jing must now know that Bei is Xiang Liu.

Xiaoyao looked at Jing, then at Bei , and said to Bei, "Have you finished eating? Let's go after eating!"

Bei put down the wine bowl, stood up, and said politely to Jing and Chang: "Let's go first, you two can use it slowly."

 

Even the punctuation in this passage is full of emotion.

 

"He knows Fangfeng Bei is Xiang Liu ?! " ? ! Xiaoyao was shocked and her next reaction was:

"Now Jing must know that Bei is Xiang Liu." The dash serves as a turning point and an emphasis, directly expressing Xiaoyao's concern: Bei's identity will be exposed in front of Jing.

Contrast "Na Jing must have known that Bei is Xiang Liu now", a very calm statement.

 

""I dare to swear on Li Rongchang's life that Jing has a deep affection for you, and you are the only one in his eyes and heart. "

Xiaoyao turned around and left . The night was quiet and the road was long. Where was her path?

Xiang Liu looked at the end of the dark long street and remained silent. "

 

Does Xiaoyao want to discuss Jing with Xiang Liu at this time? Li Rongchang said so many things about Jing in front of him, but Xiaoyao ignored him, but got angry when he stepped on Fangfeng Bei. Listening to old man Li Rong singing, he realized that Xiang Liu's identity was exposed and left with him quickly. Li Rongchang, what if Jing was very affectionate towards him? If I didn't write " Xiaoyao turned around and left ", I could still imagine her lonely heart when she heard Chang's words: It turns out that he always had me in his heart, we were just destined to have no destiny.

But he turned around and left, making it clear that he didn't want to hear it. What did he do to me now?

 

If Fangfengbei is just Fangfengbei, just a playmate of hers, then discussing your views on love and life with Fangfengbei is a real discussion. But Fangfeng Bei is Xiang Liu , the person she called after waking up in the thirty-seventh year, the person she hinted that she wanted to spend her life wandering on the island, and the person she still wanted to test out even though she was engaged. Discussing "companions" with him is a clear hint. This logic is like Xiaoyao singing "We will never be separated" in the big whirlpool on the sea, but if it is sung to someone other than Xiang Liu, it will have a completely different meaning.

 

The road is long, where is her path?

 

Xiaoyao asked softly: "Bei, tell me...why is it so difficult to find someone to go with you?" ""

Although I am engaged to Fenglong, Fenglong is not the person I want to be with, do you understand? The person I want to travel with is you.

 

"Fangfeng Bei said: "It is not difficult to find someone to go with you, but it is difficult to find someone who has the same interests, loves you, and can make the journey interesting. ""

Of course you can marry Fenglong, but do you really want to? Will he make you happy?

 

"Xiao Yao asked: "Is it true that you will never forget someone for the rest of your life? ""

The person you are talking about is yourself! But you are clearly by my side, and you clearly know what I am thinking, but you avoid talking about it. You are so close and so far away. If you are not willing to be this companion, how can I forget you in the future? Old man Li Rong can't forget it, and I know I can't forget it either.

 

""It depends on who it is. If the person you are talking about is Jing, I think it is very possible. ""

Don't look at me, there is no hope between us.

 

""Are you saying that he can't forget me, or that I can't forget him? ""

Are you saying that Jing will never forget me? I know that Jing has deep feelings for me. Maybe to him, I am the person who travels with me. If I leave, he will never forget me. But you said I can't forget him? I'm talking about you, what are you talking about?

If Xiaoyao's previous question "I can never forget someone in my life" really meant "Will I never forget Jing in my life?", then there is no question of what Xiang Liu meant by asking "is..." Or” is no longer true. Once a person has preset an answer in his mind and is right, he will naturally follow this line of thought instead of clarifying the question.

 

"Fangfeng Bei smiled: "It's up to you. ""

You know what I mean.

 

"Xiao Yao frowned and said angrily: "There are many good men in the wilderness! ""

Marrying Hong Leong is no big deal.

 

""There are many good men, but I'm afraid there are not many men who can truly put you into my heart. ""

Fenglong doesn’t take you seriously.

 

""What do you mean? Shouldn't I marry Honglong? ""

I know Honglong doesn’t take me seriously, but what about you? If I don’t marry Fenglong, who should I marry?

 

""I don't mean anything, you asked me, I just told my opinion truthfully. ""

I'm just telling you, don't be impulsive and think carefully if you want to marry Fenglong.

 

""Xiang Liu, I really don't understand what you are thinking about? ""

Since you think I shouldn't marry Fenglong, you also know that the person I want to go with you is you. You clearly know the affection between you and me, but you don't want to give me a little hope?

 

""You and I are just passers-by in this mortal world, just keeping each other company when we meet, just looking for fun! Why should you care what I think? ""

Now I can only be with you for a short time, and I can't give you any promises about the future.

 

Xiaoyao laughed self-deprecatingly: "I'm overthinking it!" No matter what you are thinking in your heart, it has nothing to do with me anyway! ""

I understand, you won't choose me.

 

In this conversation, both people are playing tricks on each other. Xiaoyao's crazy output hints, Xiang Liu moved flexibly to dodge. It's even more confusing than the conversation on the island behind the sea, and it's extremely heart-wrenching to watch.

 

Let me cry for a while before writing this...

 

Xiaoyao was silent for a while and said calmly : "Jing already knows that you are Xiang Liu. He will definitely not tell my brother, but if Fenglong knows, my brother will definitely know." You...be careful. "

Xiang Liu glanced at , but Xiao Yao avoided his gaze and asked, "Who is that old man selling donkey meat?"

"I was once a subordinate of Chi You, a survivor of the decisive battle in Jizhou. It is better to live with all the deaths on my back than to die." Xiang Liu smiled, "Actually, for a general, the best ending is to die in On the battlefield.”

It was obviously a warm summer night, but Xiaoyao felt chilly.

Having arrived at Xiaozhurong Mansion, Xiang Liu and Xiao Yao stopped at the same time, but neither left nor entered. They both just stood silently.

In the past, I felt that there were more opportunities to meet, but I don’t know since when, Xiaoyao always felt that meeting each other was less than once. Tonight, this feeling became more and more obvious.

After a while, Xiang Liu said, "Go in!"

Xiaoyao always felt that there was something she wanted to say, but when she thought about it carefully, she couldn't think of anything. She said, "Now is no better than before, so you'd better come to the Central Plains less often."

Xiaoyao originally thought that Xiang Liu would ridicule her, whether she was worried that Zhuan Xu would kill him or that he would kill Zhuan Xu, but she didn't expect that Xiang Liu said nothing and just looked at her.

Xiaoyao waited quietly , but didn't know what she was waiting for.

Xiang Liu's cold voice sounded: "Go in!"

Xiaoyao smiled and saluted Liu Lianren , then turned around and knocked on the door. The door creaked open, and Xiao Yao stepped in. When he turned around, Xiang Liu was still standing outside. He was dressed in white and had black hair. He was very handsome, but he was like the white water and black mountains in the north. Even when the wild flowers were everywhere, there was still a lingering desolation.

Xiaoyao couldn't take another step and looked at Xiang Liu steadily . The door slowly closed and Xiang Liu's figure disappeared. "

 

"Actually, for a general, the best outcome is to die on the battlefield."

Xiaoyao completely understood what Xiang Liu meant - it's not that I don't understand your feelings, it's not that I don't want to go with you, I have chosen my own path, and you have your own path to walk.

 

"You go in!"

That is your world, where are your relatives and friends. We have all gone too far on our own paths.

 

At this time, Xiaoyao really realized that he was going to lose Xiang Liu.

 

On Lantern Festival last year, the lights in the flower market were as bright as day. On the top of the willow tree in the moonlight, people meet at dusk.

On Yuan Ye this year, the moon and lights are still there. I can't see anyone from last year, and my spring shirt sleeves are filled with tears.

 

Every time I read the scene where the moon shines on the willow trees, the lanterns come on, and Yao Bei bids farewell in the long night, I will think of this poem, with tears streaming down my face and a loss of consciousness.

 

When were the ice crystal balls made? I think that's after this.

Xiaoyao had already felt that it would be difficult to see each other again in the future, and understood the reason why Xiangliu had feelings for her but could not go with her. After saying goodbye solemnly with "a bow and a bow" , Xiaoyao looked at Xiangliu steadily, as if to make him Engraved in my mind and in my heart.

 

"When Xiaoyao returned to her residence, Xinyue and Anian were both there. They were drawing on the clothes they bought during the day and talking lively. Seeing her coming back, they smiled and complained: "Good sister, next time you Could you please say hello to us before you suddenly disappear? Fortunately, the guy at the spice shop said you left with your friends and told us not to worry. "

Xiaoyao smiled but didn't answer.

The two of them continued to discuss what kind of dress they should make. They talked about a dress worn by a certain noble woman and wasted a good piece of fabric, laughing together.

Xiaoyao huddled on the couch, feeling confused. These people were her relatives and friends. Why did she feel so lonely? "

 

When Xiang Liu's figure disappeared, when she returned to her relatives and friends, Xiao Yao finally understood deeply how much she couldn't bear to leave him, how much she wanted to be with him, and how lonely she felt without him by her side. Just like Xiang Liu only understood what she was afraid of when Mei Lin tortured and killed Xiao Yao once, Xiao Yao only understood what losing Xian Liu meant to her when it seemed that they would never see each other again in this life.

 

"Although she likes the company of others, she is very picky about who she keeps company with. If she doesn't like it, she would rather stay alone and enjoy herself."

——2-4 <Depend on each other in life, follow each other in death>

 

Therefore, Xiaoyao actually made the ice crystal ball after Xiang Liu almost explicitly rejected her again. After spending four years trying to let go of him without success, she gave up the perseverance that she had always thought was very important. For a slim hope, she gave up the most courage she could to let her heart be with him. There is nothing to hide from. Of course she understood that Xiang Liu could not give up the Shennong Rebel Army. She had fully understood it as early as on Eagle Back, in the rebel barracks, and at the bottom of the sea. At the cost of her willingness to give up everything, leave Zhuanxu, and betray Xuanyuan and Gao Xin, she asked Xiang Liu if he would take her away.

 

Although, the result was that Xiang Liu completely cut off any possibility between them, and he let Bei die without saying goodbye.

But anyway, before Bei died, he took Xiaoyao away from the wedding. This should be something Xiang Liu has always wanted to do. He took Xiaoyao away as Bei, which was his inner response to the ice crystal ball, "I am willing to take you away." But he let Bei die out of reason. To Xiaoyao's response, "I'm sorry, we can't do it anymore."

 

Xiaoyao said from the beginning that she was very passive and would not take the initiative to fight for it. She once said to Xiang Liu:

 

""In the relationship between people, one person must take the first step. Needless to say, it goes without saying between men and women. This is also true for parents and children. When the children are unaware, parents will start to pay. I have always been selfish and would never be the one to take the first step, but between Anian and I, I decided to be the one to take the first step. It's not because of how good or worthy she is, but because of my father and Zhuanxu. I am willing to pay for A-Nian first for my father and Zhuanxu. ""

——1-13 <The peach blossoms shine brightly>

 

However, between Yao and Liu, after thirty-seven years under the sea, it was Xiaoyao who took the first step. When Xiang Liu had not given her any promise and the possibility of choosing her was very small, she first gave verbal hints. , and finally the ice crystal ball confessed. Don't say that Xiaoyao should be more obvious and straightforward. This is the biggest and bravest step that a person like her who extremely suppresses her true feelings, attaches great importance to her family's position, and is extremely unwilling to give trust and expectations can take. step.

 

We understand it, and so does Xiang Liu.

 

But what would happen if you took her away? He will not give up the morality in his heart, will not let Xiaoyao endure the pain of fighting with her relatives, and he does not want Xiaoyao to lose her after falling deeply in love. He can make her "strong enough to protect herself and have somewhere to go" , but he himself is not the right person for her to have "someone to rely on" . It's not about ability or willingness, it's about suitability. The problem between them has been in this "fit" from the beginning, not in feelings.

Xiaoyao's confession to Xiang Liu's ice crystal ball is her only fight against fate, bloodline, position, and her only fight for love in the book.

 

When a person constantly promises you and tells you that he likes you, you will naturally have expectations for him, and any efforts you make will seem to give you a positive result.

But when a person keeps rejecting you and hints that he can't be with you for the rest of his life, you obviously can't see a glimmer of light, but you still want to bet everything on yourself for that little bit of hope.

 

Tell me, why is this?

 

So, should we still blame Xiaoyao for not being brave enough?

 

In this almost hopeless state of mind, the Mermaid's tentative hand was already the limit of what she could do. If she really asked Xiang Liu about his feelings clearly and put everything on the table, asking him to give her a clear answer or promise, then I would think that she doesn't love Xiang Liu that much.

 

Because the basic tendency of love is dedication, which comes from the heart and helps the loved one do everything they expect. If she knew that Xiang Liu already had the loyalty of Shennong Yijun, and still forced him to choose between loyalty and love, then in my heart, her love for Xiang Liu is not that deep, and it is nothing more than that of Zhuan Xu or Zhuan Xu. The extent to which Jing likes her and wants to possess her.

 

Just because of deep love, Xiaoyao will not force Xiangliu; just because of deep love, Xiangliu will respect Xiaoyao. Both sides live up to themselves and fulfill each other within their own capabilities. 

@HeadInTheCloulfs

about Xiao Yao's being scared

i had this topic in mind for long to include in the XY’s mouthful of lies series 


Do you think she is aware of this parallel? And if she is what does it tell her about her feelings and relationship with Jing? We have talked about Tian'er and Chunzi's relationship being the model/parallel for Jing/XY in this thread as well.



As I move through the pages, I'm really excited to read more about everyone's analysis of Chuanzi and Tian'er.

In terms of good storytelling, Tong Hua used the Qingshui Town arc (act 1) as a foreshadowing setup for everything that's going to happen in the rest of the story. (Side note: XY's reveal ceremony marks the end of Act 1. Act 2 ends when CX becomes Emperor, and Act 3 is where all the decisions and choices XY and CX made come to a resolution.)

With that in mind, I've analyzed what happens to XY or what XY says as an indicator of her decisions and choices in the latter acts.

In Act 1, XY's observation of Chuanzi and Tian'er's relationship, TH writes, "This is actually an interesting gamble. Tian Er doesn't believe Chuan Zi will want to be with her forever, so right now, she's giving him all fake affection. But the more Tian Er is nice to him, the nicer Chuan Zi is to her. The fake affection will gradually be mixed with real feelings, and as a lifetime passes, even the false becomes true. However, during this process, it's not without risk. Tian Er is gambling with her heart, and if Chuan Zi dares to discard her, then one of them is going to end up dead." (Chapter 4, Kaola's translation). In Yangzi's portrayal, XY is seen to have a pessimistic attitude towards it (Episode 6, 36:51). In both the novel and drama, Jing listens attentively, and in the drama, Jing is written to appreciate Tian'er's risk.

TH's setup is important as it sets two precedents for XY—her relationship with Jing and her reluctance to marry FL.

In CX captivity, XY reiterates her outlook on Tian'er's decision, "Xan Tian Er's life is a struggle, and when a man thinks he is helping her by easing her struggle, he is putting her into a different kind of struggle....Perhaps most women choose to struggle with a man easing their load; at least there is some happiness, some hope that the man won't let go one day. But I'm not like that! I would rather be roasted all alone, struggle all alone because at least my hands are free. Pain makes me hope for escape; a man's hands make me fear he'll let go. I would then reach out and hold onto him tightly, collecting all the happiness tightly."

In the Dragon Bone Prison oath scene, while Yangzi portrayed her skepticism with a snicker, in chapter 8, "Xiao Liu suddenly burst out laughing, and Shi Qi didn't know if her laughter was mocking him for daring or...." She already had no hope for Jing, but her kindness takes the better of her. She laughs because she was overconfident she could guard her heart. At this point, she has no romantic feelings for Jing; yet despite it all, she took the leap of faith just like Tian'er.

Right after her half-rejection/half-confession to XL -- and instead of receiving his refusal to the reality, XY receives his cruelty only, to swim back alone -- to which Jing is there to help her back on shore.

In the drama, during the scene, I felt Yangzi portrayed XY's lie to herself through her tone of voice. It feels very unlike her, and because of the tone inflection change, the scene becomes jarring (and for me, very unlike XY) because up until this point, XY treated everyone around her with jest, sarcasm, pessimism, and frankly.

This will be the first of many events where every time XY is disappointed by XL, she takes initiative to be closer to Jing. She acts upon her statement, "I would reach out and hold onto him tightly, collecting all the happiness tightly." A significant scene would be after the marriage snatching, where XL lets her feel his heart hurting under the disguise of killing her, and of course, the last time they will see each other where she declares never wanting to see him again in this lifetime.

In my reflection, XY's feelings for Jing are always on the surface, much like Tian'er's affection for Chuanzi. Jing is like Chuanzi, the one to make the moves and always ready to reciprocate XY's affections. XY is like Tian'er; she doesn't believe Jing truly loves her, wait a lifetime for her, or make the first move towards her. So, she makes the moves, hoping the "false will become true..."

Overall, in my analysis, she can't love XL; she doesn't even have the luxury to pretend, but she could with Jing.

As for FL, I feel that while she is aware of FL's reasons for marrying her, his idea of love and marriage is not one she can stomach. She doesn't want to be the one fooled into feeling loved (Chuanzi); she rather be the one fooling (Tian'er). It comes down to her sense of control.

 plor20:
Overall, in my analysis, she can't love XL; she doesn't even have the luxury to pretend, but she could with Jing.

There is different between the novel and how the drama tunrned out. In general, if there is not specific mentioning, most of the post refer to the content in the novel. Of course we alway can express our opinion based on both drama and novel. Just make it clear. 

What do you exact mean "she can't love XL; She doesn't even have the luxury to pretend"?

The forshadow of "Tian Er-Chuanzi's treating each other" was not applicable for XY-XL relationship. Tian Er expected a man to help her from burning life. She relied on Chuanzi. Thus, she pretended to love, be nice to Chuanzi etc...XY did not consider XL as someone she could rely on for several reasons that she knew since she met him. She thought she could not "let him" to her dream. In fact, she still fell into him. There are many evidence for XY's love to XL. But she hid that feeling and didn't acknowledge it. One the other hand, XY and Jing followed the "Tian Er- Chuanzi" model.

She can't love XL becuase of her long list reasons we all know, she doesn't have the luxury to pretend to love XL is a rhetorical statement that reinforces XY's decisions that she can't love XL. 

When I make my analysis, I do it incorporating both the novel and drama because  the slight differences between them helps clarify the nauces that is often lost in live adaptations.

This wasn't analysis about YaoLiu following the Chuanzi/Tian'er relationship. It was an analysis on how XY perspective on Chuanzi and Tian'er's relationship affected her decisons in choosing Jing.

 H19279:
What do you exact mean "she can't love XL; She doesn't even have the luxury to pretend"?


 plor20:
She can't love XL becuase of her long list reasons we all know, she doesn't have the luxury to pretend to love XL is a rhetorical statement that reinforces XY's decisions that she can't love XL.

I could be wrong, but I took it to mean XL can't admit, even to herself, that she loves XL.

I'd argue that XY intellectual decision to not love XL, or admit that she does love him, wavers as her situation changes and her understanding of love (which is influenced by her consideration of Chuanzi/Tian'er's relationship ) and what she wants.


 plor20:
When I make my analysis, I do it incorporating both the novel and drama because the slight differences between them helps clarify the nauces that is often lost in live adaptations.

This wasn't analysis about YaoLiu following the Chuanzi/Tian'er relationship. It was an analysis on how XY perspective on Chuanzi and Tian'er's relationship affected her decisons in choosing Jing.

I tend to do the same, though probably relying on the drama more, as I haven't really read the book, except what I've read here in bits and pieces.

There's a lot of discussion here that XY's interactions with Jing are a substitute for XL ... or sometimes an antidote to XL interactions.  I can see some of that, but I don't think all of her interactions with Jing have to do with XL.

Oh, and welcome to the thread!  We can get chatty and very ... detail oriented here -- in multiple languages.  The other XL thread is just for crazy fun and Tan Jian Ci related stuff.

 plor20:
In terms of good storytelling, Tong Hua used the Qingshui Town arc (act 1) as a foreshadowing setup for everything that's going to happen in the rest of the story. (Side note: XY's reveal ceremony marks the end of Act 1. Act 2 ends when CX becomes Emperor, and Act 3 is where all the decisions and choices XY and CX made come to a resolution.)

Hmmm.  I've always thought that the Qingshui Town arc was setup, but didn't see it as foreshadowing for the rest ... except for a few of the obviously things.  I need to take another look at in that light.  Though I've always been bothered by the gender change of WXL, mainly because I like WXL better.


 plor20:
In Act 1, XY's observation of Chuanzi and Tian'er's relationship, TH writes, "This is actually an interesting gamble. Tian Er doesn't believe Chuan Zi will want to be with her forever, so right now, she's giving him all fake affection. But the more Tian Er is nice to him, the nicer Chuan Zi is to her. The fake affection will gradually be mixed with real feelings, and as a lifetime passes, even the false becomes true. However, during this process, it's not without risk. Tian Er is gambling with her heart, and if Chuan Zi dares to discard her, then one of them is going to end up dead."

This is XY's take on it -- and I don't think it is necessarily true.   I think the key thing here is that for the fake to become real, Tian Er will have to gamble her heart, i.e. XY will have to do the same, IF she wants a real love.  But neither Tian Er or XY have to gamble their heart, since their goal isn't a lover, but a secure future, and a companion who won't abandon them.  Of course, XY may be lying to everyone, including herself, and what she is really is looking for is a lover.  Plus, Chuan Zi is in the power position in this relationship, whereas Jing is never in the power position in his relationship with XY.

Something else that this points out, which I've been meaning to address for a while is the idea of the relationship being transactional and the obligation of gifts.  Of course, Jing, as the merchant prince, would listen to that.  This is why he repeatedly offers or tries to deny payment for anything that XY wants.  He's being nice to her, with the obligation on her to be nice to him.  This is why XL makes his interactions with XY 'transactional' even if they really aren't or his help doesn't require 'payment.'  BUT, it makes sure that XY doesn't feel she has to be nice to him.  That their interactions aren't based on gift obligation -- but on real feelings for each other.


 plor20:
In CX captivity, XY reiterates her outlook on Tian'er's decision, "Xan Tian Er's life is a struggle, and when a man thinks he is helping her by easing her struggle, he is putting her into a different kind of struggle....Perhaps most women choose to struggle with a man easing their load; at least there is some happiness, some hope that the man won't let go one day. But I'm not like that! I would rather be roasted all alone, struggle all alone because at least my hands are free. Pain makes me hope for escape; a man's hands make me fear he'll let go. I would then reach out and hold onto him tightly, collecting all the happiness tightly."

Hmmmm.  This just reminds me that XY has issues ... and lies alot.  lol  Interesting use of "rather being roasted alone." Heh  This is just confusing.


 plor20:
In the Dragon Bone Prison oath scene, while Yangzi portrayed her skepticism with a snicker, in chapter 8, "Xiao Liu suddenly burst out laughing, and Shi Qi didn't know if her laughter was mocking him for daring or...." She already had no hope for Jing, but her kindness takes the better of her. She laughs because she was overconfident she could guard her heart. At this point, she has no romantic feelings for Jing; yet despite it all, she took the leap of faith just like Tian'er.

I'm pretty sure the Jing fans would argue with you about XY's feelings for Jing at this point.  However, upon thinking about, I believe you are correct, that she didn't think of Jing romantically at that point.  Especially given how ... uncaring she was in Haolin as far as Jing was concerned, and she was laughing over pictures of XL in the mirror while making him poisons. 

She wasn't the only one who thought she could guard her heart either ... remembering XL saying the same much later.

I think she took a chance, given that her situation was uncertain at that point.  And as usual, she hedged her bets with a 15 year promise.

To Be Continued

 Kokuto:
Interesting use of "rather being roasted alone."

This is the translation by Kaola. In the original chinese text, she would rather be burn and suffer everyday. Adding "Alone" can cause ambiguty. The full original text and comparision in translations can be found here https://mydramalist.com/discussions/lost-you-forever/110123-xl-and-xy-story-and-romance-warning-spoilers?pid=2922553&page=442#p2922553. I also did an analysis on this point. 

"Maybe many women will choose the pain of being held. At least there are a few drops of honey occasionally. At least they are not being burned. At least they can hope that the man will never let go. But I won't! I would rather be burned and suffer every day. My hands are free, and the pain will make me think about escaping. But when I am hugged by someone, I will use both hands to hold him tightly because I am afraid that he will let go. I would forget to think because of the few drops of honey he gave me. In fact, she was the one who finally saved Sang Tianer, not a man! Sang Tianer has me to help her, but who will help me? God can help humans, Who will help the God? Obviously not! I still think it is safer to hide in a hard shell. I have suffered too much in my life, and I don’t want to suffer anymore or get hurt again."

 H19279:
With regard to the recent topic of XY's insecurity and passiveness, the wedding with FL was also an example for it. Clearly she did not want to marry FL.

The way Xiao Yao handled the entire marriage situation with Feng Long had me side-eyeing her. It also showed how deeply insecure and passive she was. And how despite her feelings for Xiang Liu, she was not steadfast. And also selfish. It's a bit me, me, me when it comes to XY.

She and Feng Long were engaged for 6 years. 2 years into the engagement, she started making the crystal ball, which indicated that she didn't want this marriage. Right up 'til setting a wedding date, she could have called off the engagement. If she still hadn't given up on Xiang Liu and wanted one last chance, she should have called off the engagement before doing whatever she wanted. This would have been the respectful and right thing to do for all parties involved. The way that Xiao Yao acted in this situation is not that much different to the way that Jing asked for the 15-year promise while still engaged to FFYY. Both Jing and XY acted out of selfishness and fear. XY was worried that Xiang Liu might not respond to the crystal ball in the way that she'd hoped so kept her engagement to Feng Long as a "backup" plan, since her #1 "backup" of choice, Jing wasn't available. 

When Xiang Liu didn't respond, Xiao Yao still could have gotten out of the marriage. Instead, she just passively resigned herself to it until Xiang Liu came to throw her a lifeline and "forced" her to break the engagement without having to take any responsibility for it.  


 H19279:
Since returning to Gaoxing, she could not speak her thought out confidently in such important decision. (Remember she did not say yes to YSQ's deal in the dragon bone prison but only tap the hands). This time, she just nodded her head. How reluctant she was

The way XY became passive and gave in to her "blood" and position once she came back to her princess identity was sad to see. As WXL, she had freedom and agency in ways that she didn't as XY; she was like an ornamental bird in a gilded cage. I think it's because she didn't want to risk being rejected and losing her family so she couldn't be true to herself; just fell in line to be accepted.