Xiang Liu and Xiao Yao’s Story and Romance

 liddi:

If that were the case, then only readers who have knowledge of the classics are able to glean the full meaning of what she is trying to imply, which certainly excludes me. As such, I can only infer from what hints I can see from the text itself, and not some unseen lines from poems of bygone years which I never read, and probably would not understand without someone to explain it to me.

Time to go back to school...

I did not pay attention to the title of the chapter at all. For me, it's just number. But it's interesting to read detail analysis of this novel. That is why I keep interest in it and this discussion. I know enough the story plot. Unlike Jinger fan, I prefer the storyline between XL-XY. It requires some digging work already. 

 liddi:

That would explain why he had to seal her consciousness and put her in a deep sleep after he had healed her physically, because he knew she was conscious prior to that.

However, it still does not answer my question why the article claimed that Xiang Liu did not really put her under a sleeping spell, when the text describing Xiao Yao indicates that he did do so.

I think XL didn't know her mind or spirit which separated from her body was conscious during 37 years. He was relaxed during the 37 years. He didn't know XY knew what he did in 37 years. Her mind only slept when he slept. On the last treatment, her mind merged with her body and she passed out (unconscious). So she didn't know what happened since that moment till the next morning. she didn't hear when he left. 

I think the 2nd suicide might be similar. Her mind/spirit is awake in the darkness. if her heart is sensitive enough (it was one of very first thing that recovered from limo in 37 years) then she must feel his heart beat when he was nearby. After she got blood fed, she would be come unconscious without any extra spell. And she would not know his actions after that such as erasing the memories, undoing the bugs. We know that her heart was stronger than the initial stage of 37 year (no pulse). How strong was it? Only she knew

@H19279

Same with the title of chapter 50.
As if it were the wedding of XY and Jing, but the poem was taken from one of the lines of Farwell's poem, about a husband who leaves his wife to go to war... I think I've already posted it in the group.

Yeah, I too belive the poems aren't picked at random. I did read a few and the resemblance with a lot of stuff from the novel is really uncanny. I don't know in how many languages did the book got officialy translated to, but I am sure the main target is the chinese population, which I belive has enough knowledge about their classics. The poems, from what I read on google, are very popular and well known, they are far from being obscure, they are classics. 

 liddi:

If that were the case, then only readers who have knowledge of the classics are able to glean the full meaning of what she is trying to imply, which certainly excludes me. As such, I can only infer from what hints I can see from the text itself, and not some unseen lines from poems of bygone years which I never read, and probably would not understand without someone to explain it to me.

Time to go back to school...

I sense some frustration in this post, liddi. I may be way of. of course. Nevertheless, I would like to say that arts, be it music or literature can be enjoyed at various levels. We each have different backgrounds, educations and experiences which shapes and colours our interaction with the arts. I knows nothing about music theory so my enjoyment of music is different to someone who do. But at the end of the day, it's about our own subjective enjoyment of the art. I don't pretend to know music theory, but I'm.not going to let that stop me from enjoying it in my own way :-).  

It's the same for interpretation of the work. While I wouldn't say that every interpretation is valid (some are just so off that you wondered if they're reading the same work, lol), people are going to think what they want and I don't hink even the artist's intention will change that. 

I recent saw an interview with David Fincher about how Fight Club has been misinterpreted by a certain population. He basically said that he's not responsible for it, that people are going to see what they want to see, he doesn't know how to respond and he doesn't know how to help them ?. If Tong Hua is as blunt as Fincher, she probably would say something like this to the way some of her work has been interpreted.  She and every artist out there! 

This thread has been fun and interesting. Take from it what you can, but don't let it take away from.your enjoyment or think that you need to be some kind of classic Chinese literature expert to enjoy it. Pfff! I highly doubt Tong Hua would wa t that since it would mean less money in her pockets :-)

 liddi:

(assuming I am able to convince myself of the validity of the theories)

Yes. As Tong Hua hasn't come right out to talk about her influences and writing method, we are left to wonder if we are on the right track or if we're simply over-analyzing and seeing things that are actually not there. I don't know much about Tong Hua's background, but given that her historical novels have roots in Chinese' mythology and history, I think it's fair to suspect that she has sufficient interest and understanding of Chinese' literature. Dreams of the Red Chamber is one of 4 Chinese Literature Classics so it's not a stretch to think that Tong Hua had read it, knows about its writing method, and applied it in her own work. Same for The Spring and Autumn Annals and the various classic poems that she'd used as the chapter titles.

 liddi:

Honestly though, for the most part, I rarely paid much attention to the chapter titles - having enough trouble trying to find the hidden lines within the narrative itself. Which means that there is another whole new angle to explore within the novel itself, assuming I have the time, energy and sufficient knowledge and experience to do so.

You have time if you are so inclined to explore further. You know the language so you already have the advantage over the rest of us who have to deal with some really bad translation :-). INot for the first time do I wish that I'm fluent in all the world languages so I can experience literature as they are written.

 liddi:

Tan Twan Eng's "House of Doors" is still glaring balefully at me for setting it aside for some fictitious world revolving around a Nine-headed Demon...

Xiang Liu is very compelling :-). Besides, we have a little book club thing going on here and have had some great discussions so it's not all fluff. 

I hope you won't be too hard on yourself with this :-)

Behind the poem of chapter 32,souvignon blanc
"A Shadow Headed in Which Direction"

Seeing a wild goose die in love

Huan Haowen "Mo Yu'er·Yanqiu Ci"

"Ask the world, what is love? Direct teaching of life and death. How many times has the old wing been cold and hot? Happy and fun, parting is hard, and there are even more idiots. Jun Yingyou said: There are thousands of miles of clouds, thousands of mountains and twilight snow, who is the only shadow going for?

Hengfen Road, lonely in those days with the flute and drums, the barren smoke is still calm. Conjuring up the soul, He Yiji, the mountain ghosts cry from the wind and rain. Heaven is also jealous, Untrustworthy, Ying'er and Yanzi are all loess. For thousands of years, in order to keep the Sao people, they sang and drank wildly, and visited Yanqiu."

Seeing a wild goose die in love

" Yuan Haowen was a famous writer in the late Jin Dynasty and early Yuan Dynasty. When he was 16 years old, he went to Bingzhou (in Taiyuan today) to take an exam. On the road, he met a man who hunted wild geese and heard him tell a strange story: that morning. After capturing a wild goose and killing it, another wild goose that escaped from the catching net hovered in the air, wailing, refused to leave, and finally hit the ground quickly and died.

Legend has it that the wild geese are very loyal. They are truly consciously monogamous. If one of a pair of wild geese dies unfortunately, the other will never find a partner for life. Therefore, there are always descriptions of lone geese in ancient Poems.

Someone in Dangkou Town, Wuxi caught a wild goose and was about to slaughter it for cooking. When a scholar saw it, he felt compassion for him, so he spent money to buy the wild goose and take it home as a pet. He was worried that the wild goose would escape, so he tied up its two wings with a string so that the wild goose could not fly. The scholar raises it among chickens, ducks and poultry, and it is usually docile, but as soon as he hears the chirping of geese in the air, he keeps his head up and crying. One day, a group of wild geese flew over the sky, and the wild geese screamed loudly. Suddenly a wild geese flew down from the sky and stopped on the eaves. The two wild geese cried relative to each other, flapping their wings as if they had known each other. The wild goose on the ground wants to let the one on the eaves come down, and the wild goose on the eaves wants to bring the one on the ground up. The scholar saw this and understood that these two wild geese must be their former partners, so he cut the thread on the wings of the wild geese on the ground and let them fly away. But this big goose's wings had been tied for too long and could no longer fly. It fluttered its wings, but it just flopped and fell off. It failed repeatedly. The big geese on the eaves guarded it there until it was getting dark, and suddenly flew down from the eaves, and mourned each other beside the geese who were unable to fly. The scholar went to look again the next day, and the two wild geese were already dead.

Moyu'er·Yanqiu Ci" is a lyrical poem. On the surface, it is a metaphor for human love by describing the love of a pair of geese, but in fact it is not just about love. Behind this poem, it also reflects Yuan Haowen's longing for his soul mate and life confident.

How much joy, how much pain, or infatuation like children in the world. The wild goose who sacrificed for love thought to himself at that time: That evening, I crossed thousands of miles of clouds and overlooked the earth, thousands of mountains, all covered by thick snow. It's freezing cold, and the future is uncertain. Now in this world, I am the only one left. Who can come and walk with me? Without a partner, why should I move on?
The relationship between this pair of geese, I am afraid that even the gods will be jealous. Such an infatuated wild goose, I don't believe that after it dies, it will turn into a handful of loess just like those ordinary warblers and swallows. Therefore, when Yuan Haowen became an adult, when he recalled the incident of the death of a geese in love, what he saw in his eyes was no longer a simple relationship between a man and a woman. This kind of feeling is a feeling of longing for "confidant" on a larger scale, including the love between men and women.

A person is actually very afraid of loneliness. But it is very regrettable that most of the time in one's life, one has to face loneliness.We all want to find a soul mate who shares the same aspirations as ourselves, because only in this way can we support us through this lonely and lonely life.No matter if the road ahead is Qianshan Muxue or Huohai Daoshan. As long as there is such a soul mate who is willing to come and walk with us, then we have nothing to fear . On the contrary, we may even lose the confidence to live.

The ancients often said: A scholar dies for a confidant. At the beginning of this poem, a question sentence has been passed to point out the theme of the poem. That is - what kind of feelings can make a person make a contract with another person without fear of life and death?

Everyone is afraid of death. Why do some people not only do not fear death, but actively ask for death after losing their soulmate? Could it be that all of this stems only from the instinctive impulse of animals? Obviously not so.

In fact, the goose who sacrificed for love in the poem did not die for "love", but for the sake of "a thousand mountains and twilight snow, only to whom the shadow goes"! Yuan Haowen obviously felt that it was very difficult to find a soul mate who was willing to die for each other. So he wants to build a grave for Dayan, and then write this poem, so that the literati through the ages will take this opportunity to drink and cry because the confidant is hard to find.

 windiaaa041293:

There is a kind of miss, which is called I love you, but you don't know it. I know, but you are leaving.

---

Oh you
Even if I can't see you
Can't even hear your voice
But I'm fine
Parting is sad
And my heart hurts
But if you're happy
If you can smile
So I am
The more I delete
The more I miss you
Since today
I shed more tears
Like fate
I can't have someone like you
Only you
As many as my tears
Wish you happy
goodbye My Love

https://www.tiktok.com/@myheartisyours85/video/7299934264349478150?_r=1&u_code=e4fe367i4e8gj9&region=ID&mid=7242956943727315717&preview_pb=0&sharer_language=id&_d=dg6li52gleeckc&share_item_id=7299934264349478150&source=h5_t&timestamp=1699710315&user_id=7159045582216414235&sec_user_id=MS4wLjABAAAAeCYxZvUPoHSebL_YCYBO48mcSyINM5ewS6MV28nJH2EL0MgLfKJAWB8Hfc5z3FbT&social_share_type=0&utm_source=copy&utm_campaign=client_share&utm_medium=android&share_iid=7215035367769605914&share_link_id=0ccc65fd-9aef-4344-b450-dac6a5265e6e&share_app_id=1180&ugbiz_name=Main&ug_btm=b5836%2Cb2878

Such a lovely artwork of Xiang Liu ❤️ Thanks for sharing ˶ᵔ ᵕ ᵔ˶