blabla100:
I really doubt YANGZI said that, perhaps it was something taken out of context, do you have the link to the reel?
If she didn't love XL, then the lovers bugs would had kill them. It is obvious you are a Jing fan and that's perfectly fine, but I can't help but wonder why do Jingers always forget or minimize the bugs, they are quite a important part of the story after all.
No ,I haven't the link.
I'm a XL fan, that's why it hurts me so much...
Well for Tonghua i think it is more than a romance story, but let's be honest, most readers and viewers are drawn to this story because of the romance. I personally didn't really care much about who gets to rule the world or about the traumas that each character had. The politics are TH's weakest link IMO and the choices they made out of fear have their purpose up to a point. I personally wanted to see how these characters fight their fears, go against the flow, but instead they all reached a point where they got what they wanted, but gain nothing worth living for. Or în other words be careful what you wish for because you might get it.
I mean, that there's the typical romance story with a happy ending that there are tons of, and then there are stories with romance that don't necessarily have a happy ending, like Romeo and Juliette, Wuthering Heights, Tristan and Iseult, Gone With the Wind, etc. These aren't books about politics or worldbuilding, but focus more on the romance and characters.
With the exception of XL, all the characters continued living, with what they gained. CX gained an empire and world peace -- I'd hardly say that was nothing worth living for. If he isn't happy in love, that's his own damn fault. He's married to at least two women who love him, and there's other women who love him. He's going to end up like Granddaddy Emperor, realizing too late, that he threw away important relationships.
I know you don't agree with my take, but as I said before, I personally belive XY did try at one point to fight for love, but XL kept cutting her wings. Sure she could have done more, I wish she would have done more, go against everyone and everything, XL would probably still rejected her, but be ambitious for once. She kept saying her biggest fear is to be abandoned by the people she loves, but all I could see is her giving up on herself for the people that loved her. Couldn't she be selfish for once? She wanted someone to put her first, but she herself wasn't able to do that. Yes, her romance with XL would have been doomed, but at least I'd have seen her staying true to herself. Ending up with Jing as a companion is unfair for both of them. But idk, for me love is important.
Yes, we do disagree, as I think XL gave XY chance after chance, but she could never bring herself to admit or confess her love. She wanted XL to do all the work and all the changing ... and even then, I think he would have found a way, had she only committed. I still think snatching her from the wedding was the last chance he gave her, but she STILL couldn't admit what she wanted.
What you are wishing is that XY was a completely different character and story. I understand. I often wish XY was a different character who wasn't afraid of going for a great love. Though, I often thought she was unreasonably selfish and in denial, but true to her damaged self.
windiaaa041293:
@liddi..^^
1、防风邶、王仓王玄和宝柱的笔画都是十七。（也许是一种奇怪的暗示，如果命运不开玩笑，如果有足够的机缘，他们都可以是她想嫁的十七。当然啦，最早表哥还是叫颛顼的）2、相柳只有一只耳朵（卩），防风邶有俩耳朵（阝）。注意看这俩耳朵的位置，相柳对比防风邶，没有左耳。
3、小夭给左耳起的名字，因为他没有左耳，所以就叫左耳。
4、小夭跟邶在一起的时候玩香，后来就不玩了，将名为“梦”的香给了苗圃，从而成全了苗圃与左耳的缘分。左耳是闻到苗圃身上“梦”的香味与小夭一样，没有杀苗圃，而是在她身上闻来闻去。很多人都说，左耳是相柳的影子。左耳问小夭，我会成为相柳吗？小夭说，我更希望是邶。
5、夭璟大婚那章的名字，叫结发为夫妻，恩爱两不疑。出处是苏武的《留别妻》，我也放一下原文。很奇怪，这首诗全篇是一个要去战场的丈夫跟妻子诀别，殷殷嘱托妻子的情景。如果是三流作家没文化瞎引用也就罢了，作者是桐华，书名就叫长相思，桐华没有琢磨过这首诗是不可能的，为什么会这么用？为什么全篇多次提到一个将军最好的结局是死在战场上？为什么小夭想了半天说想明白了生和死？这暗线真的是令人寒毛都起来了。结发为夫妻，恩爱两不疑。欢娱在今夕，嬿婉及良时。征夫怀往路，起视夜何其。参辰皆已没，去去从此辞。行役在战场，相见未有期。握手一长叹，泪为生别滋。努力爱春华，莫忘欢乐时。生当复来归，死当长相思。
6、书里清水镇的故事，像是全书的一个摘要，类似于红楼梦里面甄士隐一家的故事。
This is what the text says:
1. The total number of strokes in Fangfeng Bei, Cang Xuan and Bao Zhu add up to 17 (perhaps this is an unusual hint. If fate had not had a laugh at their expense, if there had been enough opportunities, they could have become the Shi Qi (17) that she wanted to marry. Of course, originally the cousin's name was Zhuan Xu).
2. [The characters in the name] 相柳 Xiang Liu only has one ear (卩)* while 防风邶 Fangfeng Bei has two ears (阝)*. Please note the position of the two ears. When compared to Fangfeng Bei, [the word] Xiang Liu does not have a left ear [e.g. the radical is not placed on the left side of the word].
3. Xiao Yao was the one who gave Left Ear his name. Since he did not have a left ear, he was called Left Ear.
4. Xiao Yao played with fragrances when she was with Bei. In the end, she no longer dabbled in it and gave the fragrance which she named "Dream" to Miao Pu, thus fulfilling Miao Pu and Left Ear's fate. Left Ear smelled that the scent of "Dream" on Miao Pu's body was the same as Xiao Yao's, hence he did not kill Miao Pu but sniffed her all over. Many people said that Left Ear is the shadow of Xiang Liu. Left Ear asked Xiao Yao, "Will I become Xiang Liu?", to which Xiao Yao replied, "I preferred [you became] Bei."
5. The chapter title for YaoJing's wedding says "Hair bound together as husband and wife, With love and devotion that is never doubted.", from Su Wu's** 留别妻 Parting from My Wife. I will also post the original text. It is very curious that the entire poem describes a husband taking leave of his wife before going to the battlefield, and his ardent exhortations to his wife. If this was a third-rate, uncultured author blindly using [the poem], there is nothing to say. However, the author is Tong Hua, and the title of the novel is Eternal Yearning. It is impossible that Tong Hua did not ponder over the poem, so why was it used in this way? Why was it mentioned multiple times throughout the text [of the novel] that a general's best ending was to die on the battlefield? Why did Xiao Yao take a long time to think before saying that she finally understood life and death? The hidden line really makes one's hair stand on end.
Hair bound together as husband and wife,
With love and devotion that is never doubted.
Sharing in joy this evening,
Wittiness and beauty in this perfect hour.
Called to a faraway place for war,
Why are eyes lifted into the night.
With the disappearing dawn,
It is time for us to part.
Serving on the battlefield,
Not knowing when we will meet again.
Holding your hand with a long sigh,
Tears flowing as we are parted.
Enjoy the glorious seasons with all your heart,
Never forget times of happiness.
If I survive, I will surely return,
If I die, consider it as an unending yearning.
6. The story of Qingshui town is like a summary of the entire novel, similar to the story of Zhen Shi Yin's family in Dream of the Red Chamber.
* This refers to the radical component of the word.
For Xiang Liu's 柳 Liu, the name of the radical 卩 is 单耳旁 Single Ear Component
For Fangfeng Bei's 邶 Bei, the name of the radical 阝 is 双耳旁 Two Ears Component
** The poem is about Su Wu
I can't place which part of the novel Xiao Yao said she finally understood life and death. Can someone please enlighten me?
6. The story of Qingshui town is like a summary of the entire novel, similar to the story of Zhen Shi Yin's family in Dream of the Red Chamber.
Curious... Can the summary of the story from Dream of the Red Chamber be seen from the story of Zhen Shi Yin's family in Dream of the Red Chamber?
The last time i watched that drama was about 25 years ago. and the chinese name converted in english doesn’t make so much sense to me. Is that the family of the maid who was kidnapped in the beginning of the drama ?
i just checked. it is Xiangling’s family. Then i think that statement is correct.
H19279:
The last time i watched that drama was about 25 years ago. and the chinese name converted in english doesn’t make so much sense to me. Is that the family of the maid who was kidnapped in the beginning of the drama ?
The volume opens with a cosmic scene: A goddess creates a series of stones to construct the heavens and leaves one stone behind. Two monks who appear throughout the novel, Impervioso and Mysterioso, take this stone. The goddess inscribes the stone with stories and messages and then sends it down to Earth with Impervioso and Mysterioso by the fairy Disenchantment. For a few chapters, the stone’s whereabouts are unknown.
The narrative then continues with Zhen Shi-yin and Jia Yu-cun, two friends living near the Bottlegourd Temple. Shi-yin loans Yu-cun money to prove himself as worthy of becoming a magistrate at the capitol, and Yu-cun becomes a prominent figure among the ministry. On the contrary, Shi-yin’s daughter is kidnapped and sold into slavery, and his house burns down. He ends up becoming a Taoist monk and wanders the countryside with Impervioso. Yu-cun’s story eventually leads to a countryside tavern where the reader learns about a boy named Jia Bao-yu, from the prominent Rong family, who was born with a piece of inscribed jade in his mouth. This jade signifies him as a boy of high karmic energy, which makes him highly romantic. It is unclear whether the boy will use that energy for good or evil, but the potential lies within him
The last time i watched that drama was about 25 years ago. and the chinese name converted in english doesn’t make so much sense to me. Is that the family of the maid who was kidnapped in the beginning of the drama ?
i just checked. it is Xiangling’s family. Then i think that statement is correct.
Do we now have to analyze the entire story of the family in Qingshui City? ^^
Taspia:
No ,I haven't the link.
I'm a XL fan, that's why it hurts me so much...
I think there is some misunderstanding as to how Tong Hua described Lost You Forever.
She did not say that it was a happy ending. She merely said that it was not a tragedy:
Q: After reading the book, many readers said "长相思，摧心肝 Eternal longing, breaks my heart" [a poem by renowned poet of the Tang dynasty Li Bai]. In your opinion, is this work a tragedy at its core?
TH: I don't think that it is a tragedy because everyone obtained what they wished for, and achieved what they wanted most. For example, the male protagonist Cang Xuan hoped to be safe and be able to protect himself and his family, and he did it. Xiang Liu was unfailingly loyal and righteous to the end, and died on the battlefield. Tushan Jing hoped to be with Xiao Yao, while Xiao Yao hoped to have someone accompany her without abandoning her... As for those things that could not be obtained, life has never been perfect, and it is already no easy task to get what one wants most.
I believe I might have an idea which Yang Zi interview you were referring to. Assuming we are talking about the same interview, it is during Yang Zi's live broadcast "Xiao Yao's tea gathering" on 8 Aug 2023. However, Yang Zi did not say that Xiao Yao never loved Xiang Liu. What she said was that she never knew how much Xiang Liu loved her, and that they were aware from the start that their opposing stance meant they were fated not to be able to be with each other.
The following is a quick transcript from 14:42mins onwards focused on Xiang Liu topics:
[10:58m] Actually after leaving Qingshui town, I was always in an emotional state, because I feel that lively, cheerful, carefree Xiao Liu no longer exists. I always want to cry everytime I think of it. After she became Xiao Yao, actually what I like better is... actually I feel that she was pretty sad in every stage because she now has responsibilities, burdens, duties. Perhaps, in certain aspects, during certain phases - she was happy when she was playing with Fangfeng Bei because she did not have to worry about responsibilities and burdens; at certain times when she was with dating Shi Qi and in Chenrong manor, she was happy; even when she was with gege, when they are not talking about matters pertaining to the country, not having to worry about whether they would still be alive the next day, just having a simple meal together - she was probably happy during those times too. However, I feel that for Xiao Yao, her happiness was always in stages, and short-lived. I feel that later, Xiao Yao is not as happy.
:
[12:13m] Q: Let us talk about happier things. We have a lot of adorable animated characters (?). Which one do you like most?
A: At first it was Fei Fei, which only existed a day. Then there was Furball. The scene where everyone saw me pull its feather actually does not exist in the script. When I was filming it, I was very angry. I was thinking I got beaten up, got thrown off, and I could not do anything, so I thought let me pull a feather, because I hope that Furball was flying so it would not be able to do anything to me even if I yank its feather, so I really yanked its feather while we were filming. I thought it would be edited out in post-production but I did not think that they would leave it in including Furball's yelp, so I thought that was amusing. Then there was our little fox belonging to Tushan Jing. I thought it was very adorable too.
:
[13:58m] Has Xiao Yao ever loved Xiang Liu? I feel this question... I feel an adult's world and perspective on love is not just solely "love, love". I feel that is a little shallow. To me, all the character arcs in Lost You Forever are not... of course I am very happy that everyone loves all our characters a lot, and I am very happy that so many drama fans, book fans and our own fans are supporting us. I hope everyone would try to understand our characters based on our character arcs. Actually I feel that Xiao Yao and Xiang Liu is not just a simple who loved whom. They were both... I felt that in the beginning, everyone had the chance but the reality is that they did not choose Xiao Yao. This was not up to Xiao Yao to choose. One thing I really pitied Xiao Yao is that her character's fate was such that she had no option to choose anyone. In the beginning, I felt that perhaps Cang Xuan also had a chance. That is my opinion. But Xiang Liu had his 国家大义 (greater good of the nation). To some extent, I feel that Xiang Liu achieved a good, perfect end for himself. He was a general, and in the end he died on the battlefield, fulfilling his life's meaning and duties. So from a certain viewpoint, that was also a good end for him. His life was fated to not be able to be with Xiao Yao. In the previous generation, due to the problem of standpoint (opposing sides) and fate, my mother A Heng and my father Chi Chen ended up with a tragic ending. As such, in this generation, it is possible that Xiang Liu and Xiao Yao were fated not to be able to be together. They are... as everyone watching the drama feels that they should be a certain way... but they are always one person moves forward, and the other takes a step back; one person takes a step forward, the other person moves backward. In some ways, everyone was very clear-headed because from the start, they knew that the both of them would never work out. I think we should interpret it in this way, rather than just focusing whether they do love or do not love each other. I think that is not what this drama, or Xiang Liu and Xiao Yao are trying to convey.
:
[33:20m] Did Xiao Yao know what Xiang Liu sacrificed? I am not omniscient so Xiao Yao did not know. From Xiao Yao's POV, she had no idea what kind of feelings Xiang Liu had for her. Actually she totally did not know. So I often feel very sad for Xiang Liu, but from Xiao Yao's POV, she did not know.
:
[35:31m] I am very happy everyone is discussing the drama. But I would still like to ask everyone to watch rationally, because every character has its own mission and obligations, so it's not just solely love or whatever. They are all flesh and blood characters. So I can particularly understand everyone, after reading the novel, would analyse the drama from a God/omniscient perspective, but I hope everyone would still follow the drama daily as the plot unfolds, so as to understand each character's hardships. In addition, we filmed this drama for half a year, and we worked really hard and sacrificed for every scene in the drama, so I hope that those who love our drama Lost You Forever, no matter which character you love, would be able to get along together and support our drama. That's right. Please do not quarrel. Watch the drama properly. Don't quarrel, okay!
:
[37:06m] [Singing 长相思 Lost You Forever]
:
[39:14m] [Singing 偏爱人间烟火 with TJC - video was muted]
:
[42:58m] Did Xiao Yao see Xiang Liu cry? Of course not. She was already unconscious, so how could she see Xiang Liu cry? That scene was for the audience, to let them know his feelings, but based on my stipulated circumstances, Xiao Yao did not see it, and had no way to see it. So you cannot judge why Xiao Yao did not based on the viewer's perspective, but consider it from a normal perspective, which was Xiao Yao really did not see it.
:
[43:24m] Also I feel that Xiang Liu is very noble. He did not let Xiao Yao see how he really feels because he knows that, after he expresses his feelings, perhaps everything would change.
:
[43:48m] Is Xiao Yao disappointed that it was Fangfeng Bei, not Xiang Liu? Of course not. Why would Xiao Yao be disappointed? Xiao Yao was not disappointed. I feel that in that scene today, she did not know who came into the room, and after she removed the mask, she had a moment of confusion whether it was Xiang Liu or Fangfeng Bei, which was why she asked, "You are?". Then when Fangfeng Bei gave her the snarky smile, she thought it was Fangfeng Bei because only Fangfeng Bei would do something like that. Xiang Liu basically does not smile. So her reaction was, "Sigh, Fangfeng Bei, why is it you? What are you doing here?" Although her words were harsh, but she still saved Fangfeng Bei. Although she told Xiang Liu "Let us part and not whatever", but she hurried back with the poison and wanted to see whether Xiang Liu had left, only to find he had gone. So she is a harsh-mouthed but tender hearted girl.
:
[47:02m] Did Xiao Yao start falling for Xiang Liu when they were in the ocean? That scene has not aired yet and people are already analysing it beforehand. Wait for the scene to air. Like I said, Xiao Yao is not most people's first choice, because everyone have their life mission, their fate, their story so Xiao Yao is not like she is a princess, so she can get whatever she wants. Life is not like that, so it's not like Xiao Yao should or shouldn't be like this, but it is more of even if Xiao Yao were a certain way, the ending would still be the same because that is her fate.
:
[56:44m] Why did Xiao Yao choose Jing? In Jing's world, Xiao Yao is the only one. She did not choose Jing. Rather it is... Xiang Liu has his loyalty to the nation. He could never be with Xiao Yao based on his stance because his priority is his country. Gege is also not possible because he is going to be king, so in this world, only Jing can put Xiao Yao first.
6. The story of Qingshui town is like a summary of the entire novel, similar to the story of Zhen Shi Yin's family in Dream of the Red Chamber.
Curious... Can the summary of the story from Dream of the Red Chamber be seen from the story of Zhen Shi Yin's family in Dream of the Red Chamber?
In a way, yes! After the framing story of Nu Wa and the Jade Stone in the immortal realm, Dream of the Red Chamber opened with good friends Zhen Shi Tin and Jia Yu Cun. Zhen Shi Tin's life essentially foreshadows the life of the main male character of the novel Ja Bao Yu (the mortal incarnation of the Jade Stone).
Dreams of the Red Chamber is a complex novel - there are reasons why it has a whole branch of literature devoted to its analysis called Redology. One of the main themes of the novel is the relationship between real/unreal. The novel starts with the following saying:
Truth becomes fiction, when fiction becomes truth
Real becomes not real, where the unreal is real
The names of Zhen Shi Tin and Jia Yu Cun reflected this. Zhen is a homonym for "real" while Jia is a homonym for "unreal/fake". The name Zhen Shi Tin is a homonym for "truth hidden/hiding the truth", while Jia Yu Chun means "false words". Together they essentially imply using false words to hide the truth. These two characters are complete opposites of each other, yet they are good friend - so real and unreal, truth and false, dream and reality have an intimate relationship and it can be difficult to tell one from the other. Very much like life, isn't it? Aren't we all guilty of lying in some way or another, at some time or other - even to ourselves? You will see this theme runs throughout this novel, in its usage of dreams to reflect the dreamer's personality and reality.
This goes for reading the novel; you can't just take what is written or what the characters are saying as real; not when they are invested in hiding the truth! Can you see this in the characters of Lost You Forever?
P.S. Went on a bit of a tangent, but I thought it applicable given our discussion on Tong Hua's use of the "snake in the grass" technique etc.
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